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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Aug 16 2005 at 2:43pm | IP Logged
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Yesterday I was so frustrated with my 4 month old's sweet baby's sleeping pattern I just wanted to scream. I realized it made me feel like a parenting failure.
He's healthy...he's thriving! He smiles all the time and is is our joy. I should be grateful. I am. And a thriving baby shouldn't make me feel like a failure...but he sleeps like all my other ap babies. And I'm soooooooo tired...
In a nutshell, we have always attachment parented. I hooked up with LLL when my first was a newborn. I'm grateful for all they taught me. I learned the basics of mothering from them, and they were a godsend, for sure. My best friends were made at those meetings. All my babies have nursed practically forever, all slept in the family bed for years...yada yada you know the rest of the story... :-)
NONE of my children have slept through the night until they were well over 2...usually after I weaned them sometime 1/2 way through my next pregnancy.
I went to bed thinking, "I wonder how all these other moms get their children to sleep through the night. Is crying it out really the only alternative?
If you've parented this way for years and years, did you ever hit a point where it was just too exhausting for you? Did you just pray more :-) and somehow muddle through, or did you make some changes?
I could use some wisdom. Its getting harder and harder for me to rely on afternoon naps when I have so many other children to attend to.
Blessings,
Bookswithtea
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Erica Sanchez
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| Posted: Aug 16 2005 at 5:14pm | IP Logged
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Oh, Bookswithea, I know I am not the best person to give you advice, but am sending a hug and offering up a prayer now.
I have come to the attachment parenting style slowly. None with my first (heartbreaking now to think about how I did things with her  and oh, if I could only go back!), and then a little more with each new baby, but probably not really "all the way". Well, maybe for the first year.....so, just not as long maybe....the last baby was nursed just until 2 years....
One thing that really helped me, and I say this with caution because it is probably not attachment stlye parenting at all, was the swing. I could catch a half-hour break or so if needed and all my babies have loved it. They would normally fall asleep anyway. Please know that I would never let my babies "cry it out" and I would never recommend that style of parenting (anymore), but one aspect of that method that seemed to help me is the pattern of feed-eat-sleep, rather than nursing the baby to sleep each and every time. I would start to be vaguely aware of any patterns (not schedules) the baby and I were getting into around 3 or 4 months and then, if it worked without any crying, I'd put the baby down for a nap after some awake time. Sometimes it would work and other times not. I might try the swing at this point or I might just nurse again. And then by 8 or 9 months we seemed to be in a pattern of sorts. Maybe this isn't attachment style parenting at all. I always nursed the babies to sleep at bedtime and if they woke up in the night.
I only offer this advice because my kids are great sleepers! Even the last three who were much more fed on demand, in the bed, never cried-it-out, etc., are/were great nappers and go to bed at night with no fuss. Now, they don't sleep through the night until later, but after about a year they did or woke up once to nurse. But, they've all napped so well - a good 2 hour nap each afternoon until age 3 or so.
I don't know if this helps at all! Good luck!
__________________
Have a beautiful and fun day!
Erica in San Diego
(dh)Cash, Emily, Grace, Nicholas, Isabella, Annie, Luke, Max, Peter, 2 little souls ++, and sweet Rose who is legally ours!
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jdostalik
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| Posted: Aug 16 2005 at 7:44pm | IP Logged
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Dear Bookswithtea,
Hang in there...You are doing what Cardinal Mindzenty said is the most important work on earth--being a good mother! 
I have used AP with all my children, though I adhere more to the kind of parenting that Sheila Kippley speaks of in her book, Ecological Breastfeeding, vs. what the Sears or other AP experts speak of...
Sleep deprivation is a terrible thing for a busy homeschooling mom and wife...What time do you go to bed? When my babies are small (6 mos or younger), I usually go to bed for the night, when they do, around 8:30 or 9:00, and I sleep until they wake up in the morning (around 7 am or sometimes later...) Now admittedly, the do wake up numerous times to nurse during the night, but I find that if I get to bed early with them, that there is usually a good stretch where they will sleep without waking up (usually the first stretch of nighttime sleeping). I get enough rest, because I am in bed with them for at least 10 hours!!! This does make it hard on the husband. My husband is a patient, long-suffering saint.  He also knows that if he really needs some time with me, I will stay up a bit later if I'm not totally wiped out... 
I haven't been able to nap regularly since I had my 2nd baby...it just isn't feasible with so many kids running loose and unsupervised--I can't sleep!
Another thing that sometimes works for me when the babies are small and I am exhausted is to tank them up really well right before Daddy gets home and then head off to bed for an hour...I usually try and have a simple dinner (hot dogs, frozen pizza) ready and usually everyone is happy to have a fun, unhealthy dinner with just Dad and I get a nap ALONE!! The baby usually does just fine for that one hour but my dh knows that if the baby starts fussing and needing me, my naptime is up!
Just hang in there and feel free to private message me if you'd like to talk some more...I'm sure I have more ideas up my sleeve but my 11 month old is needing me, so off I go... 
__________________
God Bless,
Jennifer in TX
wife to Bill, mom to six here on earth and eight in heaven.
Let the Little Ones Come
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Aug 16 2005 at 8:49pm | IP Logged
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I have had some success with the eat/play/sleep rhythm. That solved the overnursing problem, anyway...I have an unusually overactive letdown (according to the Lactation Institute rep. I talked with after my first) and I was unwittingly giving my babies tummyaches by nursing too often.
I've just recently started trying to go to bed very early. Last night it was 8:30pm. Its helping a little bit, I guess. I have a toddler who isn't ready to give up naps, but that means she is up fairly late, too. And its awfully hard to go to bed early when my kids are up later than I am. When dh is home, I miss him so much I want to stay up with him, even though he's a great guy and would understand if I went to bed early. He knows that the time I go to bed the night before directly impacts what's for dinner the next night and if there are clean socks to be worn when he needs them! lol
What I don't get is how come some babies are content to sleep in their cribs, even just for naps? I put mine down (not hungry, use a pacifier to help with the overactive letdown, swaddled, and rocked to sleep) and within 20 minutes, they are up again,and still tired! I've read all that stuff about how babies need to learn to put themselves back to sleep, but I don't know how to teach that, short of the "cry it out" thing...
I feel like an idiot...like I ought to know how to do this by now...Good grief, this is my 5th baby, after all!
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Erica Sanchez
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| Posted: Aug 17 2005 at 10:41am | IP Logged
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Don't feel like that, Bookswithtea! You're just really, really tired right now! I think when we are tired, it is harder to let our natural mothering instincts work - not to mention the lack of patience tiredness seems to bring! This particular baby will probably be a breeze later on, he just needs you more right now. It might get better in just a month or so, so hang in there!
Do you use a sling? I never did, but it sure seems to work for some moms. I used the nice front pack kind and the babies slept well in there and both hands were free for teaching or whatever.
Also, could you catch a nap on the couch with baby laying on you while the other kids watched a video? Even once or twice this week might catch you up a little.
Another prayer being said for you right now.....
__________________
Have a beautiful and fun day!
Erica in San Diego
(dh)Cash, Emily, Grace, Nicholas, Isabella, Annie, Luke, Max, Peter, 2 little souls ++, and sweet Rose who is legally ours!
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Angie Mc
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| Posted: Aug 17 2005 at 5:01pm | IP Logged
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Hi bookswithtea,
My heart goes out to you. Everyone needs their sleep. With a 3 month old and three others...I'm with you! Since we have John Paul in our bed now for what we feel are important reasons, we don't want to change what we are doing during the night. We asked ourselves, "How can we all get the rest we need?"
Here is a simple idea that has helped us and might help you. We have a checklist that keeps track of how much sleep each person is getting at night and during the day. Each family member has promised to get the rest they need within two days (each person is different.) For example, currently I need a minimum of 8 hours at night (can be interrupted to nurse) and then I need 1-2 more during the day. (Yep...10 hours...breaks my heart...I really don't like needing so much sleep but there you have it!) Each of us uses the checklist to keep ourselves honest. If one day I only get 8 total hours, I know to make time the next day to catch up.
The hardest part for me was accepting that I needed more sleep than usual right now. By making sleep and rest a priority, I feel that I can do my highest priority work better and with more efficiency. Believe me, I'm no good to anyone when I exhausted.
I like all the other suggestions. One of my favorite daytime resting ideas is nursing John Paul while he sleeps and doing what we now call "couch work." This includes reading aloud and doing other quiet work.
I'll pray for you and all tired moms that each may find their best way to meet their family sleep needs.
Love,
__________________
Angie Mc
Maimeo to Henry! Dave's wife, mom to Mrs. Devin+Michael Pope, Aiden 20,Ian 17,John Paul 11,Catherine (heaven 6/07)
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Aug 17 2005 at 9:30pm | IP Logged
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I never thought about tracking my sleep hours before. I think my own need is definitely more than 8 hours a day. Humbling, huh?
I do use baby carriers. Thats a good reminder though. I was planning on buying a different style (I'm getting tired of the one handedness of slings) before the baby came, but never got around to getting one. Maybe I'll give that a try.
I guess the truth is there's only one way out of this and thats through it. There are no quick fixes to get perfectly sleeping babies. It makes me feel better though, to know that others are tired too. And maybe its less a failure in my own skills than just simply the nature of babies? At least I hope so...
Thanks again, everyone...and now I'm off to try to get some sleep before the baby wakes to nurse!
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Jamberry77
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| Posted: Aug 19 2005 at 12:50pm | IP Logged
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Dear Tired Mother,
I've heard about a book by Elizabeth Pantley (check on Amazon) that is supposed to be a no-cry sleep solution for babies but you have to be awake and somewhat alert at baby's waketimes for a few nights. I haven't read it but thought I'd offer that to you.
Other than that, I'll just say our boys didn't sleep through the night until age 3 (from 2-3 they'd wake up about every other night.) I would just sleep in their bed w/ them after the first waking. (This is with night weaning at 15 mo. for each, but looking back I wish I had night weaned much sooner.) I have sympathy for you and your 4 mo. baby! Try the swing. You might be able to find a baby hammock used and try that (see http://www.ambybaby.com/Home/ ). I'll pray for you! He has to start sleeping more soon, right????
Love,
Kelly in NC
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MaryM
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| Posted: Aug 19 2005 at 2:10pm | IP Logged
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Jamberry77 wrote:
I've heard about a book by Elizabeth Pantley (check on Amazon) that is supposed to be a no-cry sleep solution for babies. |
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No-Cry Sleep Solution is the name of the book. I have known many mothers who used it and found it helpful as an alternative to crying-it-out. When I read it, I knew I wouldn't be self-disciplined enough to follow it. It is very detail oriented and involves much tracking and alertness as Kelly mentioned. Also she does not advocate starting this with young babies because it can interfer with true needs of said infant to be waking and eating. It is geared to the over 8 month or so crowd as I recall.
The one thing I have been thinking about in reading this thread is to look at why you made the decision to parent in this way in the first place. What is the benefit that our little ones derive from this closeness and responsiveness to their needs when they are helpless. For me it always helped to remember that I felt strongly about the benefits.
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Mary M. in Denver
Our Domestic Church
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Willa
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| Posted: Aug 19 2005 at 2:22pm | IP Logged
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Bookswithtea wrote:
I never thought about tracking my sleep hours before. I think my own need is definitely more than 8 hours a day. Humbling, huh?
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Ask at LLL. I believe nursing a baby is actually a very "draining" activity  . My Aidan was my first baby who didn't nurse basically forever -- he couldn't eat because of medical problems and had a G Tube; I stopped nursing him at one month of age. What I noticed was that I was SO much more energetic than I had been for years.... more energetic, but also more anxious and stressed, since the lactation hormones also mellow me out.
All the years since marriage I had been either pregnant or nursing or both and I had kicked myself for being so lazy all the time. Perhaps if you put together all those hours nursing and cuddling per day and imagine you were digging dishes or working a desk job during that time, that would help you validate where your energy is actually going. SInce nursing is more valuable than either of those activities.
About the sleep patterns of the attached baby, I can sympathize. When my fifth child was an infant, I was reading those Protestant "schedule your baby" type resources -- not the Ezzos but that same kind of mindset. I prayed and prayed wondering if this "attached" thing was going to ruin my babies, who seemed to wake up and fuss every time I put them down. Finally I got to some peace about it. I believe every kind of parenting is going to bring some moments of intense doubt and frustration --and then the grass looks greener on the other side of the fence.
My 7th child Patrick was bottlefed for his first couple of months until I relactated -- it was SO hard. Nursing on demand and attached mothering has its tough moments, but I think overall is definitely easier and more convenient. My son Aidan who had the G Tube and was trained by the nurses in the hospital to sleep when he was put down in the crib, was easier to put down but more difficult in general to mother. ... my husband and I actually started trying to train him to WANT someone near him when he was falling asleep, distraught or whatever.
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AMDG
Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
Take Up and Read
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Bookswithtea
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| Posted: Aug 19 2005 at 3:42pm | IP Logged
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***The one thing I have been thinking about in reading this thread is to look at why you made the decision to parent in this way in the first place. What is the benefit that our little ones derive from this closeness and responsiveness to their needs when they are helpless. For me it always helped to remember that I felt strongly about the benefits***
When I was pregnant with my 4th child, dh and I spent a lot of time thinking about this. We were flirting with some new parenting ideas. We finally came to the conclusion that we were pleased with how our children were turning out...that they seemed sensitive to the needs of others, happy, and well adjusted. We figured it was only a piece of the equation, but part of it, nonetheless. We decided that with a few minor changes (only in order to meet our older children's needs adequately), we would stick with Attachment Parenting.
***All the years since marriage I had been either pregnant or nursing or both and I had kicked myself for being so lazy all the time. Perhaps if you put together all those hours nursing and cuddling per day and imagine you were digging dishes or working a desk job during that time, that would help you validate where your energy is actually going. Since nursing is more valuable than either of those activities.***
This is amazing. I rarely consider the amount of time required to parent like this. And it doesn't end with babies, either. Staying connected and attached to older children is time consuming, too, although well worth the time. Still, the reminder is a good one...it explains why I am so tired!
***Hang in there...You are doing what Cardinal Mindzenty said is the most important work on earth--being a good mother!***
I've been thinking about this for days. Its been ages since I considered the importance of mothering. I think I get so busy thinking about homeschooling that I forget about being a mother (or a wife, for that matter, but thats another thread for another day). I remember when I had my first child and I thought about how just nursing was such a noble thing and worth my time. Thoughts like these rarely enter my brain anymore. Mostly I'm thinking about how many loads of laundry I have to finish, what I'm going to make for dinner, will I get to spend some time with my dh today, and this week...oh my gosh, only a week till school starts again!!! Maybe I should get out my old LLL books and take a refresher course! :-)
Thank you all. I think I needed these reminders.
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4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: attachment parenting difficulties
