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Cay Gibson
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I can't wait for the DVD, Meredith. 
Don't you know, just a couple months ago I mentioned to Jenn (as she was off to take her first training in CGS) that wouldn't it be lovely for a catechist to video tape some Good Shepherd demonstrations and put them on YouTube for us to watch and learn. It would be like having a mini-online training course.
Any takers...? I'm waiting for Jenn to volunteer.  This could be the start of something awesome .
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Cay Gibson
"There are 49 states, then there is Louisiana." ~ Chef Emeril
wife to Mark '86
mom to 5
Cajun Cottage Under the Oaks
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lapazfarm
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Cay Gibson wrote:
wouldn't it be lovely for a catechist to video tape some Good Shepherd demonstrations and put them on YouTube for us to watch and learn. It would be like having a mini-online training course.
This could be the start of something awesome . |
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Now that DOES sound awesome!
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Theresa
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Cay Gibson
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Hey, and if anyone wants to take this idea and run with it...feel free. I kept waiting for Jenn to but...
I think Meredith (with Montessori) and Jenn (with her new CGS training) would make a dynamo-duo. 
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Cay Gibson
"There are 49 states, then there is Louisiana." ~ Chef Emeril
wife to Mark '86
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Lorraine
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I hope I won't disappoint or offend anyone, but when I finished my CGS training recently, my trainers specifically reminded us that we should not let others view anything we taped as "training." If we had taped anything, they should remain as our personal notes, and not to be shared with others. I thought it was a bit of a pity, but they explained that they didn't want others to think that there was an "official" or one and only way to do a presentation. Different catechists may do a presentation in his/her own way, provided that they do not deviate from the doctrinal content and direct aim of the presentation. Now I don't know if these were just views from my trainers or whether it is a general rule set by the CGS association. Anyways, I guess that may be a reason why you don't see anything on youtube.
Blessings,
Lorraine
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JennGM
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Meredith, I wish I could have attended your talk. I hope to see the DVD soon.
I'm not offended, Lorraine, but I think Cay's idea is a bit different than what your trainers meant.
There are many here who cannot have the opportunity for training in Catechesis. Many also who do not have the opportunity to actually see an atrium, to witness a presentation. And yet, they want to share some of this approach in their own home.
Poor Nancy (Hylabrook) got an earful the day of the conference, but I want to stress that Moira Farrell's album doesn't say it's true Catechesis of the Good Shepherd, nor is she trying to be pure Montessori. Her presentations are wonderful. This is one of the tools we have to use in the home, but it would be nice to be able to incorporate some "real" CGS in the presentations...the details that are lacking in Moira's albums. I was just so in awe at the reverence at the presentations, and some of the little details that just aren't conveyed in any of the books (not just Moira's albums, but the CGS books).
Cay's idea is wonderful (and I'm trying to recruit Celeste for this, since she has so many of the materials already) to just show a few presentations being done. The children don't need to be filmed. It's not necessarily "training", and of course, each catechist has their own approach. But there are things that can't be conveyed except visually -- the whispered awe, the handling of the materials, working at the child's side, not in front, minimal handling of the materials, and talking only when not moving, silence when moving, some examples of pondering questions, and the length of the presentation -- the times of silence, etc.
This would be different than some of the recordings one made in the actual training.
Does this make sense, or am I completely off?
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Jennifer G. Miller
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Meredith
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It makes total sense Jenn and Lorraine I am not offended either as I don't think this is what Cay had in mind, IMHO.
Moira's albums are for home use. COGS is for Atrium use, some can do both, some can only do one or the other and that's the beauty of choices in home education!!
I do not have the resources, time or desire to do the training right now, but may in the future, but to be able to bring this *method* to my dc at home is pure joy for me, that's all 
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Lorraine
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I wasn't at the conference  so I'm not sure what was discussed there. I recently purchased Moira's album myself just so I can see how to make some of the presentations to my children at home. I completely understand and applaud her noble intention of helping homeschooling families.
When I was attending the course, I had this sad/strange feeling about the trainers being so reluctant about album/notes/video sharing. Once I was so happy when I found out about Moira's album and I mentioned it to one of my trainers, and she had this disapproving look on her face and said, "You know that's really frowned upon." And I asked myself, "If CGS is such a wonderful thing for children, wouldn't more sharing help with spreading it?" I'm guessing that perhaps the trainers or the CGS association is afraid that what happened to the Montessori name may happen to CGS (what I mean is how Montessori was not "copyrighted" so any school can put the name up even though it doesn't follow the philosophy at all).
Anyways, I personally do think that a few video clips would be a great help to homeschooling families.
Lorraine
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lapazfarm
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Ok, PLEASE dont take this wrong, but...
This kind of attitude really rubs me raw. Not saying anyone on this board has this attitude (in fact,I see just the opposite), but it is the attitude I have run up against in other places when trying to educate myself about Montessori methods in general. I really dislike being told that I can't "really get it" on my own without specialized training, therefore I shouldn't even try. How very condescending!
I've said it before and I'll say it again, there is NOTHING I cannot learn if I set my mind to it.
Sure, the training would be great, but it isn't an option for me. So I learn on my own. Why is this frowned upon? Are they afraid I might lead my child into sin by not using the proper hand motions, not pausing in the proper spots, or doing the presentations out of order? Please!
And as Lorraine said, if it's so good, why not be joyous that it is being used at all, even if in modified form.
Moira's albums are beautiful and *accessible* and so are a blessing to those of us who have no access to an atrium or CGS training.
Videos would be an awesome addition.
Sorry. Rant over.
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Theresa
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JennGM
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Theresa, I'm in total agreement with you.
Without trying to offend or getting trainers mad at me, I keep struggling over a disconnect that I haven't been able to find the answer. Christ founded the Church for all, and ALL are to get to heaven. All the faith is accessible to all. And parents should play a dominant role in teaching the Faith to their children. If the CGS is supposed to be this ideal form of catechesis, started with young children, why isn't it more widely known and accessible? Why can't I yell it from the housetops about this great method?
And it seems like once I make it mine, after going through training, why can't I "train" others? Yes, it's not certified, but since when does the Church worry about copyright? The point is to evangelize, not hide under a bushel basket something that works and is beautiful.
No tomatoes, please. Just my own personal ponderings.
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lapazfarm
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Jenn, as usual you said it much more eloquently than I!
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Donna Marie
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I know that I have encountered this too. I simply responded to the trainer who brought the subject to my attention that the Holy Spirit has been known to show me some wonderful things and even though I have not received formal training. As a mother given many gifts by God to share with my children, I am not completely incapable of learning more about COGS or utilizing what I do know now. I know it is not the same thing, but it can still have a lot of value and meaning. I WISH I could have training, but I am not going to stop searching and learning all I can until I do.
Sometimes I think the Holy Spirit is in a hurry to teach me something to teach the kids, I learn it, am awed by it, share it with the kids, THEN find out that is what COGS has in a particular area. It is just that when there is an official COGS presentation, it is like pure poetry in motion. I want to be a part of that, but of course I have some limitations in an official capacity, but then again there is no limit to what God has in mind. I just try to do the best I can with the resources I have to make it hands-on, meaningful, full of wonder ....and more!
God love you!
Donna Marie from NJ
hs momma to 7dc 
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God love you!
Donna Marie from NJ
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Lorraine
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Oh I feel so bad now because it seems like my little post got people upset  . I didn't mean to convey the message that only people trained in CGS should teach children. I was just pointing out how some are more "protective" than others of the methodology. And I hope I didn't make my trainers sound like horribly selfish people. They are very nice people whom I learned a lot from.
Is it OK if we just forget about what I said about the trainers  and just keep our focus on teaching our children the wonderful Catholic faith with whatever method that works for our family? I'll try to be more careful in the future when I post about CGS.
Lorraine
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JennGM
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Lorraine, don't worry. I don't think anyone is upset. I do think this was brought up before. It's definitely something out there, not related to just your trainers.
There is the same friction with pure Montessori and those who want to do it at home.
Please don't worry about it!
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Jennifer G. Miller
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JennGM
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lapazfarm wrote:
| Jenn, as usual you said it much more eloquently than I! |
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Thank you, Theresa. You're way too kind!
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Jennifer G. Miller
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Meredith
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Lorraine, no one is upset, don't worry, just remember that this is "Montessori and More", emphasis on the More, just as our usual CGS discussions tend toward the *out of the norm* realm. I would love to be trained, but that's just not a reality for me, nor is working in an Atrium, but I do think it's interesting as Jenn has pointed out so nicely that there ISN'T more emphasis on sharing of people's training throughout our Church.
Definately something to ponder and please don't feel chased out of the corral, this is an interesting component worth discussing, nicely
Blessings!
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Meredith
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SeaStar
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To be honest, I had never even heard of CGS until I joined this board. There is no atrium or similar program in this area. I would think that, for helping those who want to learn, a dvd or video would only help, not hurt. After viewing it, I don't think that I would feel "locked" into one way of presenting. There is no Montessori training available in this area, either. So I need as much help as I can get.
And I am so with Theresa as far as the "I can learn anything" attitude. When I was in vet school I had to learn to topple a cow with only a rope- me, at 120lb, against a 1500 lb steer with only a few feet of rope. It wasn't pretty, but I did it. So I'm up for a challenge anytime.
And now I will also step down off my box
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lapazfarm
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SeaStar wrote:
When I was in vet school I had to learn to topple a cow with only a rope- me, at 120lb, against a 1500 lb steer with only a few feet of rope. It wasn't pretty, but I did it. So I'm up for a challenge anytime.
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Woo Hoo! You go, girl!
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Theresa
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Eleanor
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SeaStar wrote:
| And I am so with Theresa as far as the "I can learn anything" attitude. When I was in vet school I had to learn to topple a cow with only a rope- me, at 120lb, against a 1500 lb steer with only a few feet of rope. It wasn't pretty, but I did it. So I'm up for a challenge anytime. |
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Okay, now you've got me wondering... did the school have someone more experienced who could give you advice? Or did they leave you to figure out all the veterinary techniques on your own, with the help of some books and DVD's?  I don't mean to be facetious, but it seems to me that there's a big difference between "I can learn anything," and "I can learn anything without a teacher." Subjects that are more complex, deep, and just plain difficult have traditionally required studying and practicing under a master of some kind. IMO, all the technology in the world can't fully replace this.
Taking the analogy of our faith, there are many areas in the Church where we're required to go through official channels and use the "face to face" approach. All the sacraments, sacramental preparation, joining religious orders (including third orders), seminary education... these all take place in the context of a community of faith. In the same way, a Ph.D. program takes place within the context of a community of scholars. The details of these arrangements might seem inefficient, arbitrary, and painfully dependent on fallible human beings... and that's probably often the case... but we haven't come up with a better way, and maybe we never will. I don't think I'd be likely to be comfortable with a priest whose formation had been DIY. (Or a vet, for that matter!)
If the people responsible for CGS believe that a lengthy period of in-person training should be a required part of learning the method (and becoming part of the "community of CGS leaders"), then I'm inclined to believe them. Of course, we might feel disappointed if we can't do the training ourselves, but we can still use what's available to us... whether it's something "CGS-inspired," or something completely different. Either way, our children can learn to know, love, and serve God. We know that we'll receive the graces we need to educate them, even if we don't always receive them in the way that we think we need them. (If that makes sense.)
There's obviously a lack of trainers in many places, in North America and around the world. I think CGS is well aware of this, but doesn't have the resources to do much about it. Maybe we could consider what we might be able to do to help them?
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SeaStar
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I can tell you, as a vet, there have been many, many times that I have had to perform a procedure with only pictures and text in a book to guide me. The first time I had to remove a kidney is one example. I would have been thrilled to watch this being done on a DVD before I had to step up to the plate. But most of medicine is like that... hence the term "medical pioneering". I really, honestly can't think that CGS is any different- as long as the doctrine being taught is sound. In a perfect world, it would be great if we all had access to the training, but in lieu of that, can't we have a litle help on DVD?
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msclavel
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This thread is so timely for me as I have been concerned about my "lack of training" in Montessori in general. I have been lurking on this board for a loonngg time. But, I will focus on CGS for this thread.
There has been training available in my area. The cost was just too much for our family. I had already purchased and was using Moira's books. I love those books. The truth is we will never be able to afford sending our kids to an Atrium. And the truth is, even if I were trained properly, I know the Lord is not calling me to recreate an Atrium in my home. But again, I will say I love those books. I know the Lord has called me to catechize my children using them. And so I will use them and I will share with all my friends this beautiful tool I have found to teach the Faith. And I won't worry about being "perfect".
This is a huge deal for me. It has taken me months to feel at peace about my "compromise" with Montessori/CGS and putting aside my feelings of inadequacy (and yes, fear that if I do it all wrong my children will become heathens).
So thank you ladies for your support and shared wisdom. Meredith, your talk Saturday really helped me clear the final hurdle. Because, you're a mom, just like me  .
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4Real Forums : Domestic Church
Topic: Why not share your CGS training?
