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folklaur
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| Posted: June 06 2006 at 10:43pm | IP Logged
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I haven't bought anything from this company, although I have considered it...
Swimwear Solutions
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Willa
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My daughter sent me the following links since some of you have mentioned you would like to wear skirts more often but are afraid it might be uncomfortable or inconvenient while living an active mothering lifestyle.
From the site (linked below):
"This section is here to inspire you and encourage you as you seek to dress in a uniquely feminine way every day. The idea for this weekly "journal" came about as LAF fielded questions from women who said it simply wasn't practical or realistic to "go feminine" in our culture or with all the things we have to do at home and in our communities. The photos shared here will demonstrate that it isn't just practical; it is fun and beautiful to dress in a distinctively feminine manner on a daily basis. Lovely garments aren't just for church!"
Through the Week in Feminine Dress
Also, the Sense and Sensibility forum has taken up the same challenge.
This isn't to try to convince anyone that wearing skirts is the only way to be modest and holy. It's more an outreach for those who would LIKE to wear dresses and skirts and be attractive AND active, not frumpy or hobbled  Hope it helps!
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Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
Take Up and Read
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Willa
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Helen wrote:
In my simple devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary where I see myself as literally her child, I try to imitate her in all things, as a child studies her mother and walks around wearing her shoes, I look at my Heavenly Mother and see her always in a dress. I can’t get around that idea.
Our Lady didn't specify a certain style that will greatly offend the Lord. Since I'm not exactly sure which style she is referring to, I've decided to take the cautious view. |
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Thanks for your whole post, Helen. This part especially struck me and seemed to answer my question from the other thread (about why single out women to wear long flowing garments when in Christ's time, it was EVERYBODY who did so).
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AMDG
Willa
hsing boys ages 11, 14, almost 18 (+ 4 homeschool grads ages 20 to 27)
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BrendaPeter
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Helen wrote:
But who has the courage to say:
You know what ? the emperor has NO clothes on?
Who has the courage to say?
No, it is never acceptable to go anywhere clad in your underwear even if everyone else is doing it. |
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 Thank you, Helen.
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Kathryn UK
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Helen wrote:
A sweater in the summer would not be modest. The same sweater in winter would be modest. This is obvious and non controversial. |
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Help! I'm confused! This makes no sense to me at all. What am I missing? Sweater = woolly thing to keep you warm, yes?
Helen wrote:
So, your statement is truly logical. Is EVER wearing any of the modern bathing suits, even “more modest” ones ever truly modest? |
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According to Pope John Paul II, yes ...
While we are on the subject of dress and its relevance to the problem of modesty and immodesty it is worth drawing attention to the functional significance of differences in attire. There are certain objective situations in which even total nudity of the body is not immodest, since the proper function of nakedness in this context is not to provoke a reaction to the person as an object for enjoyment, and in just the same way the functions of particular forms of attire may vary. Thus, the body may be partially bared for physical labour, for bathing, or for a medical examination. If then we wish to pass a moral judgment on particular forms of dress we have to start from the particular functions which they serve. When a person uses such a form of dress in accordance with its objective function we cannot claim to see anything immodest in it, even if it involves partial nudity. Whereas the use of such a costume outside its proper context is immodest, and is inevitably felt to be so. (from Love and Responsibility)
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JennGM
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helen wrote:
The Lord is perfect and chose the perfect time (the fullness of time) to manifest Himself to the world. He chose the time of the Roman Empire. Catholic text books speak of the importance of the Roman Empire and its excellent road system, unified language, and Pax Romana which were important catalysts for spreading Christianity. Catholic text books say this is not accident.....
Clothing is definitely culturally biased. If your values are not reflected in the culture, why should the culture's clothing reflect your values? ....
When I speak to my family members about this issue, I ask them to imagine a person from a hundred years ago being magically transported to one of our modern beaches. Just imagine the reaction –
Would the time traveler die of shame?
Bury his head in the sand?
Shriek in shock?
How would he react?
Let's compare our reaction to this situation.
Well, everyone is walking around in basically their underwear, there is nothing I can do about it, I will just go along with the culture and bring my children too.
Is this how we react to other issues in which our faith is tried by the culture? Oh well, can’t do anything about it, I’ll just expose my children to it. (Obviously this is NOT the reaction of the wonderful homeschooling families who participate on this message board!) |
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I want to talk about this...but first of all, I want to say, I don't disagree with you completely, Helen, nor am I trying to attack. I'm trying to clarify and understand more clearly. I view you as extremely wise and holy and your advice is usually sound, so PLEASE do not think I'm throwing tomatoes at you.
Just some thoughts that I've had over time that were brought up by your post. I have to apologize but my brain is extremely fuzzy today, so ask questions if I don't make sense!
First of all, Roman times were EXTREMELY sinful. Jesus and Mary lived with Jews, whose dress was very different culturally then Romans. You will find evidence of scantily clad women, similar to bikinis, even, on mosaics and such of the time. In many comparisons the Roman era is similar to our age now. Sin abounded.
When I think of the early Roman martyrs, they tried to live in the culture as much as possible. They had normal professions and lived in the world. Many times one wouldn't have suspected that they were Christians. I'm not sure what is historical fiction or biography on the lives of the saints we have from then, but the stories I read say they wore fashionable clothing, but simple, not ostenatious or ornate and not revealing. In the other sense of the word, they were modest and unassuming.
But my point is they weren't COUNTER-cultural. They adapted to what is good within the culture and as St. Paul said "They will know we are Christians by our love." Their actions is what set off alarms to send to the lions.
I know Helen is "fashionable" -- her picture is lovely. She's not wearing 1890 prairie dresses and bonnets and saying we must all be counter-cultural. But I just want to elaborate on that. Years ago I met some members of Opus Dei, went to a few functions. I was so impressed on how "chic" they looked, not just members, but cooperators also. They were dressed in classic attire, with earrings and pearls to boot. When I asked about it, they said it was important to take of one's personal appearance. You cannot attract people to the Faith if you look frumpy or not part of the culture.
I struggle with whether or not we are called to be counter-cultural, or to sanctify our culture? I think the latter. Our culture is not completely bad, and it's based on Christian culture. It's our job to raise up the culture, not throw up our hands and give up.
KathrynUK wrote:
According to Pope John Paul II, yes ...
While we are on the subject of dress and its relevance to the problem of modesty and immodesty it is worth drawing attention to the functional significance of differences in attire. There are certain objective situations in which even total nudity of the body is not immodest, since the proper function of nakedness in this context is not to provoke a reaction to the person as an object for enjoyment, and in just the same way the functions of particular forms of attire may vary. Thus, the body may be partially bared for physical labour, for bathing, or for a medical examination. If then we wish to pass a moral judgment on particular forms of dress we have to start from the particular functions which they serve. When a person uses such a form of dress in accordance with its objective function we cannot claim to see anything immodest in it, even if it involves partial nudity. Whereas the use of such a costume outside its proper context is immodest, and is inevitably felt to be so. (from Love and Responsibility) |
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Kathryn, thanks for posting that quote from JPII. I always lose the exact quote, but that's my operative motto, especially "If then we wish to pass a moral judgment on particular forms of dress we have to start from the particular functions which they serve." If the swimming suit is worn to swim, then it's appropriate attire.
Think of a further mission we have...if all the good families that are striving to keep more modest lines on swimwear all evacuate our pools, how will anyone see what a better bathing suit is? And shouldn't we buying from major clothiers the more modest lines to encourage more of those suits? I've noticed Lands End and Eddie Bauer and LLBean have more shorts and skirts and skorts to wear over the suit, or as part of the suit. Modesty standard reasons? I don't know, but if we keep buying them out, they'll keep carrying them and we'll start our own fassion trend.
Trying to be optimistic! 
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Helen
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Hi Jenn & Kathryn
I saw the new posts!
I'll be back later to try to answer. 
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Helen
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Modesty is a complex question. Earlier I compared it to “end of life” issues. Each person is required to examine his situation and apply the “modesty rules.”
There are many different factors to examine: Where you are, who you are, what you are doing, to name a few.
The people interested in this topic are the good people. The people who have already given their lives over to Christ and they ask these questions because they want to serve Him better. Today I kept thinking of the parable of the Rich Young Man who asked the Lord how he could gain Eternal Life.
Yes, but I do these things already…and the Lord said
Sell what you have and come follow me.
Can this parable be applied to today’s modesty questions? Maybe, in one sense because what is practiced in the world is very far from Immaculate standards. Maybe we are being called to “give up everything.”
Since Kathryn quoted the young Karol Wojtila, John Paul II, this same Pope would be delighted if I turned to the book of Genesis to begin this part of the conversation. So often we find JP II beginning his work in the first few pages of the Bible; reflecting on the goodness of God’s creation and the havoc caused by original sin. As far as clothing goes in the book of Genesis, it is good to recall, (as Sr. Lucia pointed out in her book: Calls from the Message of Fatima),
Adam and Eve fashioned clothes from fig leaves. It was the Lord Himself who then handed them appropriate clothes made of skins.
I think in a modesty discussion, this image of Adam and Eve being handed more clothing by God Himself is an important image.
Modesty as a virtue needs to practiced as the mean between two extremes; too much or too little is not virtuous.
For example, fortitude is a virtue
Foolhardiness is not a virtue and is considered the “too much” of fortitude.
Cowardliness is not a virtue and is considered the “too little” of fortitude.
The virtue of fortitude lies between.
Both my sweater comment and Kathryn’s quote from Love and Responsibility speak to ‘trying to find the mean’ in the virtue of modesty. Modesty is not all about covering up and skin exposure. A link I gave earlier, St. Thomas in the Summa Theologica speaks of Modesty in words and deeds as well as in Outward attire. There are plenty of outfits which the skin is totally covered but the tightness or color make the item immodest. (Sarah described these situations very well in the earlier posts.)
Unfortunately I am unversed in Love and Responsibility. My understanding is that it was written by Karol Wojtila, not when he was Pope, but in the 1930’s or 40’s. I know that JP II’s other works abound with reflections on the goodness of God’s creation. He spoke about the intrinsic goodness and beauty of women, of work, of truth. It is definitely one of his themes: God’s goodness and the God’s creative goodness. I also believe that he read True Devotion to Mary many times, but only around the eighth time did he start to get it. (I’m not sure of the number, but the idea is his total immersion in True Devotion to Mary.) He dedicated his pontificate to Mary. He was often seen with a Rosary. His writing is of such depth and quality that many find it hard to read. But one can only fully appreciate his words by understanding their Marian dimension in particular and his phenomenology. I would hope that anyone translating or interpreting JPII’s works (as is done in Theology of the Body) would have in mind JPII’s unwavering Marian Devotion.
To the quote itself, if I am mistaken, correct me, but my impression is that JPII is coming from the point of view of one who was coming out of an age in which the clothing involved many layers. So he says it is reasonable to do heavy labor in clothing which is not so hot. You may show skin. I agree.
I agree that one needs to have different clothes for bathing.
(I told everyone about my bathing suit.  )
Perhaps a bathing suit mentioned in the earlier part of this thread would fulfill what JP II is saying in this quote. However, fast forward 80 years and we have a different problem. No one knows when to put enough clothing on. Because we have become accustomed to bikinis, we think a tank top and shorts are acceptable. I personally do not think this is what was implied in the quote by Karol Wojtila. I think he is coming from the other side of things, when people would not take their clothes off. (Wearing a sweater in summer.) I think the image from the Garden of Eden is totally appropriate. Bathing suits are not much more than fig leaves. The Lord holds out to us more clothing.
Modesty is a case by case decision. Each of us has to make the decision. How do we make decisions? We try to have well formed consciences. Because we receive our information through our senses, and we are bombarded with illicit images constantly, this causes a decay in our formation.
Because my heavenly Mother helps me to make decisions pleasing to Her Son, I ask myself: What would the Immaculate do or how would she conduct herself in my place? I’m sure many people would have a different response to what they think she would say or do. That is why it is important to study who Our Lady is. St. Maximilian was always asking Our Lady: And who are you?
Thank you Jenn for showing such kindness in your response. We all hope to discuss these issues in the realm of ideas. My goal is charity and I have seen charity practiced here more often than in the world beyond this message board.
My goal is not to be counter cultural. My goal is to be holy and respond to the Lord’s call. Holiness means ‘one with the Lord.’ I’ll offer the example of St. Katharine Drexel here. She was the daughter of one of the wealthiest families. When she had control of her money and she was also very pious did she just give it up over night? Just throw her money away to be poor to serve the Lord? No, she prayed and prayed. Then she began to obey her bishop. He invited her to see the poverty of the native peoples on reservations. When she saw the great need, she contributed her money. As the need arose, she gave of herself. No one needs to automatically give up swimming because of a few emails. But, more prayer is always welcomed by the Lord. He wants us to pray to Him all the time, seek Him for all our needs. If something here causes an internal struggle, take it to the Lord and let Him decide. I didn’t chose this path overnight, but it was one that slowly dawned on me.
As a final note, I have had many difficulties in living out modesty. I think I recognize my weaknesses and I am making every effort to overcome it for the Lord. It is a constant battle. How many times have I had the inspiration in prayer to do more for the Lord on this issue and then through my own weakness, vanity, or bad example I didn’t follow through. I’m sad to say, too many times. I offer my comments for those who have had the similar inspirations and had no one to affirm the inspirations; no one to commiserate with them and say "you know what, I do that too.”
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Kathryn UK
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Helen wrote:
| Both my sweater comment and Kathryn’s quote from Love and Responsibility speak to ‘trying to find the mean’ in the virtue of modesty. Modesty is not all about covering up and skin exposure. |
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I'm with you now ... and I finally got the point about the sweater. Unnecessary covering up is an excess of modesty. Unfortunately, in an English summer we have days when we need sweaters for reasons other than modesty! Picture me bemused, thinking "It may be summer but it's cold. Why is it immodest to wear a sweater?"
Helen wrote:
| Unfortunately I am unversed in Love and Responsibility. My understanding is that it was written by Karol Wojtila, not when he was Pope, but in the 1930’s or 40’s. |
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I think that it was written in the 1950s when he was Bishop of Krakow.
Helen wrote:
| I know that JP II’s other works abound with reflections on the goodness of God’s creation. He spoke about the intrinsic goodness and beauty of women, of work, of truth. It is definitely one of his themes: God’s goodness and the God’s creative goodness. |
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I like the idea that one of the yardsticks we can use in trying to find that mean of modesty is to ask whether something lends itself to revealing and enhancing "intrinsic goodness and beauty", or whether it perverts and disguises that beauty.
Helen wrote:
| To the quote itself, if I am mistaken, correct me, but my impression is that JPII is coming from the point of view of one who was coming out of an age in which the clothing involved many layers. So he says it is reasonable to do heavy labor in clothing which is not so hot. You may show skin. |
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Again, I'm not certain and could be completely wrong here ... but I think it was common for men to labour bare chested in hot conditions, going way back. I'm sure I've seen photos of miners working that way back in the 20s and 30s, for example. Norms of clothing vary widely according to culture, climate and purpose. I have a sense that part of our problem today is loss of innocence and an over-s*xualised culture which makes it difficult to distinguish what is appropriate or inappropriate.
I have a book on JPII's early life and just looked at the photos it includes to see if they shed any light on the cultural norms then ... there was one photo of Karol Wojtyla on a sporting expedition with young adults (the same group for which he wrote Love and Responsibility?) which included bare chested young men and one in swimwear that was little different from things you would see today (short, and on the tight side ... definitely not long shorts!). This would have been in the 1940s or early 50s.
Helen wrote:
| Modesty is a case by case decision. Each of us has to make the decision. How do we make decisions? We try to have well formed consciences. Because we receive our information through our senses, and we are bombarded with illicit images constantly, this causes a decay in our formation. |
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Ah yes! I think this is what I was trying to say, but said with far more clarity!
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BrendaPeter
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If we truly desire to become more modest and hence, more pure, then we must offer all these desires to Our Lady and She will guide our way.
I'm always in awe of God's goodness as I look to my own life and recognize His guiding hand and "control" in all things.
Just by way of an example, our last home had an in-ground swimming pool. As a family, we enjoyed it immensely, however, there was always a sense of dread before a visit from relatives/friends who we knew would be wearing modern swimwear. What is one to do? Post a sign that reads "Only modest swimsuits allowed"  ? Well, lo and behold, we outgrew that house & have since built our own house which, of course, does not have a pool.
We still desire that our dc become good swimmers so we've looked for swimming opportunities for them. In the summers, we typically vacation in the White Mountains of New Hampshire. It's a very family-oriented vacation spot and attracts a great number of Orthodox Jews. They are extremely modest in their attire! The adults wear only long sleeves with pants for the men & long skirts for the women. Also the women wear panty hose in the heat of the summer. I assume they don't go swimming as I've never seen any of them in a hotel pool. On our last 2 visits to New Hampshire by Divine Providence (I believe), we've had the hotel swimming pool all to ourselves.
Last summer (our 1st summer without a pool), we went to a very small family beach 2-3 times. We made it a point to go either very early in the season (May) or very late (September) and we also went around 5:00 p.m. when the beach had pretty much cleared out. The children loved the whole beach experience and both my husband and I were so grateful that we were able to keep them somewhat protected.
I should mention that I understand that we cannot protect our children from every immodest situation out there, especially in the world in which we live. But we must try to have pure intentions. Perhaps the most unavoidable area in this regard is the supermarket checkout with the immodest magazine covers. As I approach the checkout, I pray to Our Lady and my Guardian Angel to protect my eyes not only from indecency, but also from reading gossip. My children know to do the same. Often, this is the best we can do.
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Brenda (mom to 6)
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StephanieA
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<be wearing modern swimwear. What is one to do? Post a sign that reads "Only modest swimsuits allowed" >
Eekk! This will now be our problem with our above ground pool. I will struggle between hospitality and having a public pool situation in my own backyard. I am not sure exactly how I will deal with this. Luckily I am so sick this year with my pregnancy that I won't be having much company. We also live aways out from town, so our neighbors are stalks of corn. Lots of "extra" people aren't likely to want to drive out here just to swim. Luckily, most of the older cousins are boys and I think I will kindly say, "Only one piece suits" for the girls. I guess I will see how that goes. Our family lived on a swimteam for years, so my kids were terribly disappointed when all of it stopped two years ago for various reasons. Personally little girls in one pieces are a heck of a lot more modest than some of the outfits than teens girls wear to Mass. I guess I have to keep things a bit into perspective, but figure out how much I really need/want to control.
<the whole beach experience and both my husband and I were so grateful that we were able to keep them somewhat protected.>
We chose a secluded beach last time we went on vacation also. We literally saw no one. Of course, this could be because the mosquitoes were HORRIBLE and we arrived a week after it reopened after a devastating hurricane.  In fact, it was so secluded (no grocery stores, resturants, etc. for miles) that I don't know if we will go back. It wasn't quite our cup of tea. I like quiet, but it certainly wasn't very convenient with 7 kids. I like to at least treat them to ice cream, popsicles, etc. and stuff we usually don't buy, but we couldn't transfer anything like this that far from the grocery store.
<I should mention that I understand that we cannot protect our children from every immodest situation out there, especially in the world in which we live. But we must try to have pure intentions.>
Amen. My college age son still is not "allowed" to browse through a video store on our guard. If a video gets checked out, either my husband or I rent it. My 2nd son actually complained to the store manager about "Cosmopolitan" years ago at our grocery's check out stand. I didn't realize what he did until he returned and told me. If I have the kids with me at a grocery store with gross magazines at the checkout, I go first and just turn all the magazine covers around. They are so use to it by now :) - or if there is too many I have them rush through and stand on the other end.....keeps the toddler from hand-picking the candy too
We do what we can and try to maintain standards. I do what I can, but try not to stress out about it to the point of total frustration or scruples.
Blessings,
Stephanie
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marihalojen
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StephanieA wrote:
| My 2nd son actually complained to the store manager about "Cosmopolitan" years ago at our grocery's check out stand. I didn't realize what he did until he returned and told me. If I have the kids with me at a grocery store with gross magazines at the checkout, I go first and just turn all the magazine covers around. They are so use to it by now :) - or if there is too many I have them rush through and stand on the other end.....keeps the toddler from hand-picking the candy too |
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I don't know if it is a Florida thing or just a Publix/Winn-Dixie thing (our only two stores here) but they have really cool plastic flip covers that cover the picture on the cover of the magazine but not the title. They attach to the magazine rack. You could ask the manager to install those. 
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MamaJen
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Ok - I don't post much, but I am very, very interested in the modesty threads, and I have some questions.
First of all, I have one that is probably kind of silly. I *never* wore dresses or skirts growing up, and neither did my mother, so there are some practical things I just don't know. I really hate the whole "sticky legs" thing that you get in the summer, and then I notice that some on-line stores carry "pantaloons" or "coulotte slips" - are these acceptable to wear in place of a standard "skirt" type slip? Seems like a cotton pantaloon, worn under a nice flowing, airy skirt would be quite cool, especially here in the South - but will that work as far as modesty goes? And do you *have* to wear pantyhose with dresses, is it OK to wear long skirts and have bear legs underneath? Panty hose would be just unbearable in the summer here in Georgia, IMHO!
Second of all, sigh... the whole "frumpy" issue. I am *really* struggling with my weight, have been for years. I won't admit how much overweight I am, but it's a lot. Not only is it hard to find skirts and dresses in my size, I feel like I look just *awful*, and I find I am embarrassed by how I look in dresses and skirts (imagine a tented whale ;-). I truly feel called to wear skirts and dresses, I read Helen's posts and her blog and just feel such a pull in my heart - but I am resisting because of how awful I look. Is this just pride on my part? I *am* trying to control of my weight, am seeing a doctor and doing my best - but because of my medical issues (PCOS and insulin resistance) it is very, very slow and difficult. I look at all the new, stylish and pretty skirts and dresses and *know* that I won't look at all stylish and pretty in them...
I guess my question is - if you feel like you look just a tiny bit better in pants, and you feel like God is truly calling you to wear pretty, feminine clothing, but also feel like you don't look at all pretty and feminine - what is the best thing to do? Some people say they don't wear skirts because it makes them look and feel "frumpy". Some people say that looking as nice as you can and being modest (as in, appropriate, no tank tops, short shorts, etc) is more important than wearing a certain type of modest clothing (skirts and dresses). Others, obviously, believe in the great importance of no pants, just skirts and dresses. I know the opinion is rather divided here on that very issue, and it's something you have to decide for yourself... Any hints on *how* to decide, or any opinions you'd be willing to share with me? Thanks!
-MamaJen
mommy to 4 boys (9, 6.5, 5.5, 3.5) 
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JennGM
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MamaJen wrote:
| I *am* trying to control of my weight, am seeing a doctor and doing my best - but because of my medical issues (PCOS and insulin resistance) it is very, very slow and difficult. I look at all the new, stylish and pretty skirts and dresses and *know* that I won't look at all stylish and pretty in them... |
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Jen,
I know this post was so hard to write. And PCOS and Insulin resistance is such an uphill battle. I have friends that struggle and it's so hard.  for you!
I can answer that the culottes or pantaloons would be fine under the skirt...if they are hidden, just like a slip, then it works!
As far as self-image and pride in the choices of clothing, I can't answer that as well as maybe some of the other women...
__________________
Jennifer G. Miller
Wife to & ds1 '03 & ds2 '07
Family in Feast and Feria
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Helen
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| Posted: June 10 2006 at 9:25pm | IP Logged
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Dear Jen,
"Cast all your worries upon him because he cares for you.”
I Peter 5:7
This is one of my favorite passages from the bible. Cast ALL your worries upon Him. We're not supposed to pick and choose which ones to bring to the Lord, bring them ALL. This is so beautiful. We don’t have to wait for something serious to attack us, we can even go to Him because there’s no milk for the coffee, because I can’t find the book I’m looking for, and even because I “feel lousy” in a skirt.
(Jen, Does this make sense? I'm trying to say sometimes we think there are only certain parts of our trials that we can bring to the Lord. The rest we try to handle on our own. I'm just trying to say take the entire kit and kaboodle of this trial from the health issues right down to the "feeling lousy" to the Lord.)
I think this is also a place where St. Teresa’s comments about having a good friend to speak to and help you to find the right skirt would be such a blessing. (I am so sorry that you are suffering through these trials, this life is a valley of tears. Pray for hope to keep from discouragement.)
I know someone with health issues which cause weight gain. She must be around 250 pounds. When I see her in a skirt, I don't think she looks like a tented whale. I think she looks lovely. Especially when she has her hair done and makeup on. When I see her in her greasy sweats... well that's another story.
Feelings come and go. We don't have control over them. To help me see past my feelings to make decisions, I think...Well, in the future... what would I kick myself more for? Following this inspiration or not following it?
Praying for you!!
__________________
Ave Maria!
Mom to 5 girls and 3 boys
Mary Vitamin & Castle of the Immaculate
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Meredith
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| Posted: June 10 2006 at 9:34pm | IP Logged
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Well, I've had quite a discussion with my dh about this and the Modesty thread and I went to Ross Dress For Less and found some GREAT skirts for a mere 14.99 and 12.99 a piece!! I'd link them but I can't figure out how since they have SOO many different styles in different stores! They are either below the knee/above the calf or right at ankle/calf length. I am very pleased with the quality for the price and they will be great for Mass or for a little more special than everyday. I'm still trying to figure out how it could be practical for me to wear skirts on a daily basis, but I LOVE the idea and have been so enriched and inspired by this thread.
Helen, I absolutely LOVE your devotion and attitude in this realm ( and all others for that matter) and I so appreciate you speaking your heart and mind clearly and concisely in such a sisterly and loving fashion, no pun intended. God Bless everyone in their search and desire to become more holy in his sight and in you own femininity!
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Meredith
Mom of 4 Sweeties
Sweetness and Light
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Cay Gibson
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| Posted: June 10 2006 at 9:50pm | IP Logged
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MamaJen wrote:
I truly feel called to wear skirts and dresses, I read Helen's posts and her blog and just feel such a pull in my heart - but I am resisting because of how awful I look. Is this just pride on my part? I *am* trying to control of my weight, am seeing a doctor and doing my best - but because of my medical issues (PCOS and insulin resistance) it is very, very slow and difficult.
I know the opinion is rather divided here on that very issue, and it's something you have to decide for yourself... |
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My own 2 cents---for whatever it's worth---because of the division of this issue (even among friends) and the steam this issue puts off , I think it has everything to do with what God is calling you to do.
Naturally we are all raised in the cultural 'norm'. If we feel something is wrong with that scene, then we need to ask if it's God's voice calling us to do something different.
I would not imply that anyone on this list is immodest or attempting to be indecent in their dress. Taking this approach, I'm aware that some dress in skirts/dresses and some in pants.
I wouldn't dare to ask "who does God love more?" or, even worse, "Does God love me less because I wear shorts and pants?"
No, indeed. He loves me. Do I dress appropriately? Do I dress modestly enough that I would not be ashamed if God appeared before me?
It is a spiritual journey we're on. I also have felt called to wear more skirts, but the comfort of my capris and my dh's preference has held me bound. Also, I don't feel the calling from God to change my attire. Perhaps he has me on the quest but, just as I don't wear the Carmelite habit because I was not called to be a Carmelite nun, neither do I feel that a skirt will make me any more modest than I already am.
I'm leaving tomorrow for a week. I hope I haven't said anything that will spin off into a downward spirl... because I won't be here to wipe the egg off my face.
I'll finish with Meredith's lovely last quote:
"God Bless everyone in their search and desire to become more holy in his sight and in you own femininity!"
__________________
Cay Gibson
"There are 49 states, then there is Louisiana." ~ Chef Emeril
wife to Mark '86
mom to 5
Cajun Cottage Under the Oaks
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mumofsix
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| Posted: June 11 2006 at 3:37am | IP Logged
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Well Cay, fwiw, you express EXACTLY what I believe about this issue!
Jane.
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Taffy
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| Posted: June 11 2006 at 9:58am | IP Logged
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Cay,
I could repost exactly what Jane just did (but don't want to steal your words Jane). My feelings also reflect yours but you expressed them so much better.
In particular, I totally agree with this sentiment...
I wouldn't dare to ask "who does God love more?" or, even worse, "Does God love me less because I wear shorts and pants?"
No, indeed. He loves me. Do I dress appropriately? Do I dress modestly enough that I would not be ashamed if God appeared before me?
__________________
Susan
Mom to 5 on earth and 1 in heaven
Susan's Soliloquy
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Sharon B.
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| Posted: July 09 2007 at 5:01pm | IP Logged
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This is a year-old post that I linked to from Helen's blog. Wow! Not only is it a *heated* discussion but everyone here raises really terrific points in both regards.
Helen, you always write so well and say things that touch me so profoundly. They are better than some of our sermons at mass! You are so well-read and have an abundance of knowledge both on our faith and the saints who were living it more fully. I don't feel that you are preaching, but instead sharing with everyone the reasons for your convictions and they are well-founded.
Ever since I was introduced to this forum, I have really felt propelled forward on my faith journey -- like a big step forward. I have a good prayer life and a strong faith, but I feel drawn more into my journey by living it more outwardly. This topic of modesty has been one on my mind lately (I have teenagers and young girls) and I am growing in it -- though like you said, slowly. I have found myself more aware of things I didn't notice as much before -- a billboard, a song, a magazine cover. I admit that I thought I was doing pretty good with one piece swimsuits. I agree with the indecency on magazine covers, in the swimsuits, and music and televisions. I feel a real hunger to read more on the subject by both saints in their inspirations, as well as those of us trying to live it out.
You have all given me so much food for thought. I thank you all for your input. Coming here is like sitting around a table sharing a cup of tea with other Catholic moms I'm getting to know. But the beauty is I don't need a sitter and you're all there at my convenience.
Sharon, wife and mom to 4
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4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: Skirts and virtue
