| Author | |
CrunchyMom
Forum Moderator
Joined: Sept 03 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6385
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 8:14am | IP Logged
|
 |
|
MaryM wrote:
CrunchyMom wrote:
| Sorry to serial post, but the biggest red flag to me, personally, is that the standards are self described as "college prep." The end goal of education, it would seem, from the developers' point of view, is to get children into college and to prepare them to graduate from college. |
|
|
And the chief architect of Common Core (David Coleman) has recently been elected the president of the College Boards - so expect the SAT to change towards Common Core standards. ACT and AP exams to follow I'm sure.  What I'm reading is making me so angry. |
|
|
A concern for sure. Though, since the standards themselves are pretty straightforward, I'm wondering if these more advanced/comprehensive tests might remain relatively unscathed. By the time you are taking the ACT or SAT, it doesn't really matter *when* you learned long division or how to write a 5 point essay, and an AP exam that relied more on specific source documents, say, in the history tests, might actually be an improvement over the current exam, which relies on a lot more subjective ideas.
I thought that this recent article about the College Boards and the current state of AP tests was interesting.
Quote:
| Parents, beware! Either a homeschooling parent will have taught any given subject with such a different focus that the student will have difficulty in taking the test, or the parent will find herself "teaching to the test" and depriving her child of the balanced information that is one of the hallmarks of a home-school education. |
|
|
One inherent problem with any sort of top down standardization and enforcement (even if one isn't against it on principle like many of us are) is the necessity of "testing" to measure its success. It is hard to authentically educate a person if one is expected to teach to a test!
__________________
Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
CrunchyMom
Forum Moderator
Joined: Sept 03 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6385
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 10:06am | IP Logged
|
|
|
stellamaris wrote:
cheesehead mom wrote:
Also, from what I have read, many Catholic Dioceses are also jumping on board with this as they feel since the textbooks will change to accomodate CC and ACT/SAT and such they need to have their students prepared. |
|
|
Sadly, from our experience in the diocesan Catholic high school system, the Catholic schools are just public schools that charge more and say grace before meals. I couldn't see anything different in their approach to education and curriculum design, and that's truly unfortunate. I was very saddened and disappointed by the whole experience. I hope it's better in other dioceses, but the problem is that the underlying approach to educating is totally secularized and does nothing to develop the mental and spiritual life of the student. Instead, the idea seems to be just to cram- them-full-of-factoids-so-they-can-pass-the-tests-so-they -can-get-into-a-good-college-so-the-schoo-can-look-good -and-make-more-money-by-getting-more-students that they encourage in ambitious, prideful, and materialistic undertakings. Wow, didn't mean to go on like that, but it's really upsetting, ykwim?
Oh, and I'm hoping the established homeschool legal rights will help preserve our freedoms, but I'm signing petitions and intend to write my Congressmen, too. I know my representative is opposed to Common Core, but not my senator. |
|
|
I just saw this article from Circe, which, though it is not specifically Catholic, speaks to your frustration well, imo. 
__________________
Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
jawgee
Forum All-Star
Joined: May 02 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1415
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 10:32am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Math U See on the Common Core
__________________
Monica
C (12/2001), N (11/2005), M (5/2008), J (8/2009) and three angels
The Catholic Cup on Facebook
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
lapazfarm
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 21 2005
Location: Alaska
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6082
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 1:23pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
The core itself is not the problem. The standards could be perfectly designed and it would still be a huge problem.
The problem is that the further up the ladder you go (from local to state to federal)for oversight, the further removed you are from the people on the ground--the teachers--who are in the best position to know their students, how to teach them, and at what rate they should progress.
When I taught in public schools,the biggest lament amongst us teachers was that we had to follow state standards in certain subjects (math, lang arts, social studies, science) and that these standards restricted us from being creative and responsive in our teaching,and addressing our students' real needs. We couldn't vary from the prescribed course of study even if our kids needed extra time to develop understanding. Or if we did vary, then we had to play a harried catch-up game to get back on course. We were often forced to do our kids a real disservice because of these standards and it killed us because we really did care about our students.
(Why did we have to teach to those standards? Because testing was directly related to them. Kids want to do well on them, parents want their kids to do well, and funds were tied to testing, so, lots of pressure all around to teach to these tests.)
And that was state-level oversight.
Imagine how out-of-touch federal level oversight will be?
Imagine you are teaching at a tiny native village school in Alaska,where alcoholism and domestic abuse are the highest in the nation, or at an inner-city slum school where kids come in hungry from broken homes in violent, drug-riddled neighborhoods.
To expect the students in these atmospheres to be on the same level academically with kids from affluent suburbs in culturally rich areas with professional parents and stable home environments is utterly ludicrous.
And yet this is what "standardization" means. Everyone expected to be exactly the same no matter the circumstances, with very few exceptions.
In an effort to make sure education is fair and equitable (a child gets the same education no matter where he/she may live--a fine ideal) a nation-wide standard in effect does just the opposite. It ensures that those in the best position to do well on the tests will indeed keep doing well, while those who are in a less-than-ideal position will continue to be left further and further behind, struggling to keep up with a system which does not in any way reflect their reality, and is not in any way responsive to their needs.
So, whether or not the common core includes more non-fiction or more health or division in 3rd grade or any other specific standard is largely irrelevant and merely distracts from the real problem of lack of flexibility for teachers to be responsive to the individual needs of their students.
If state-wide standards have not worked,and have in fact exacerbated this mess of under-performing schools in some areas and high-performing schools in others, why in the world would national standards be any better?
__________________
Theresa
us-schooling in beautiful Fairbanks, Alaska.
LaPaz Home Learning
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Booksnbabes
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 20 2008
Location: N/A
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4141
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 1:45pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
lapazfarm wrote:
The core itself is not the problem. The standards could be perfectly designed and it would still be a huge problem.
The problem is that the further up the ladder you go (from local to state to federal)for oversight, the further removed you are from the people on the ground--the teachers--who are in the best position to know their students, how to teach them, and at what rate they should progress.
When I taught in public schools,the biggest lament amongst us teachers was that we had to follow state standards in certain subjects (math, lang arts, social studies, science) and that these standards restricted us from being creative and responsive in our teaching,and addressing our students' real needs. We couldn't vary from the prescribed course of study even if our kids needed extra time to develop understanding. Or if we did vary, then we had to play a harried catch-up game to get back on course. We were often forced to do our kids a real disservice because of these standards and it killed us because we really did care about our students.
(Why did we have to teach to those standards? Because testing was directly related to them. Kids want to do well on them, parents want their kids to do well, and funds were tied to testing, so, lots of pressure all around to teach to these tests.)
And that was state-level oversight.
Imagine how out-of-touch federal level oversight will be?
Imagine you are teaching at a tiny native village school in Alaska,where alcoholism and domestic abuse are the highest in the nation, or at an inner-city slum school where kids come in hungry from broken homes in violent, drug-riddled neighborhoods.
To expect the students in these atmospheres to be on the same level academically with kids from affluent suburbs in culturally rich areas with professional parents and stable home environments is utterly ludicrous.
And yet this is what "standardization" means. Everyone expected to be exactly the same no matter the circumstances, with very few exceptions.
In an effort to make sure education is fair and equitable (a child gets the same education no matter where he/she may live--a fine ideal) a nation-wide standard in effect does just the opposite. It ensures that those in the best position to do well on the tests will indeed keep doing well, while those who are in a less-than-ideal position will continue to be left further and further behind, struggling to keep up with a system which does not in any way reflect their reality, and is not in any way responsive to their needs.
So, whether or not the common core includes more non-fiction or more health or division in 3rd grade or any other specific standard is largely irrelevant and merely distracts from the real problem of lack of flexibility for teachers to be responsive to the individual needs of their students.
If state-wide standards have not worked,and have in fact exacerbated this mess of under-performing schools in some areas and high-performing schools in others, why in the world would national standards be any better?
|
|
|
__________________
Wife to wonderful DH, mom to SIX beautiful gifts from God!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
CrunchyMom
Forum Moderator
Joined: Sept 03 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6385
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 2:01pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Well said, Theresa. 
__________________
Lindsay
Five Boys(6/04) (6/06) (9/08)(3/11),(7/13), and 1 girl (5/16)
My Symphony
[URL=http://mysymphonygarden.blogspot.com/]Lost in the Cosmos[/UR
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Betsy
Forum All-Star
Joined: July 02 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1962
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 2:05pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
lapazfarm wrote:
So, whether or not the common core includes more non-fiction or more health or division in 3rd grade or any other specific standard is largely irrelevant and merely distracts from the real problem of lack of flexibility for teachers to be responsive to the individual needs of their students.
If state-wide standards have not worked,and have in fact exacerbated this mess of under-performing schools in some areas and high-performing schools in others, why in the world would national standards be any better?
|
|
|
So, true and well put. Unfortunately, I don't believe that this is an education issue, it's a control issue. 
__________________
ImmaculataDesigns.com
When handcrafting my work, I always pray that it will raise your heart to all that is true, modest, just, holy, lovely and good fame!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
guitarnan
Forum Moderator
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: Maryland
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10883
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 2:42pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Exactly.
Theresa, you should submit your post as an op-ed piece somewhere. Your words ring true to me, as this is exactly what has happened in my county. The schools with the most students at or near the poverty line do not do very well on the state standardized tests, and if they do perform well, it is because the teachers have been forced to set aside science, social studies, art, P. E. and more from September to March in order to prepare their students for the test. (I have anecdotal evidence from a few counties, and you can read the book Tested, which is about my county, for an in-depth view.)
If we took some of the money spent by the educational system on each student (it's over $8,000 per year in my county) and spent it on food and safety for those students, their test scores would go up, I believe. Hungry students and frightened students cannot learn well.
__________________
Nancy in MD. Mom of ds (24) & dd (18); 31-year Navy wife, move coordinator and keeper of home fires. Writer and dance mom.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
cheesehead mom
Forum Pro
Joined: Aug 08 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 374
|
| Posted: May 02 2013 at 5:32pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Well said...Betsy and Theresa...one of the many reasons I like that the church has promoted subsidiarity.
Laura
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
4 lads mom
Forum All-Star
Joined: Sept 26 2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1944
|
| Posted: May 06 2013 at 6:22am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Control=money.....it always goes back to the money. 
__________________
Mom of four brave lads and one sweet lassie
Scenes From This and That
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
Forum Locked) 
4Real Forums : Tea and Conversation
Topic: Common Core
