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AtHomeScience
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| Posted: June 11 2010 at 4:02pm | IP Logged
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KASB wrote:
| This is my son's blog. He also writes A Life of Life - A Year's Tour of Biology . He is working on a Biology text and will be offering online classes very soon in Astronomy and Biology, with Chemistry and Physics in the future. The Astronomy course will be a short 5 week class, a sort of introduction to his new website CatholicScience.com... |
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Kym, this is awesome!!! Can you tell that little post so long ago stayed with me in hopes of seeing that fruit? Does he know about Maureen Wittmann's company Homeschool Connections (I teach human A&P topics for them) that offers online courses for Catholic homeschoolers? Maybe she and your son can get together?
Faith and Science is on my list of books to get before my kids reach high school.
Well, this is much less exciting now, but I will post that Hippocampus has complete animated-video biology courses for non-majors and AP I and II. It looks pretty good until Catholic Science is up and running.
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lapazfarm
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| Posted: June 11 2010 at 4:56pm | IP Logged
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I agree! I've just gone and looked at his blog, his articles, and Life of Life and WOW! Good stuff! Here's hoping he gets that textbook written so I don't have to!LOL!
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ALmom
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| Posted: June 11 2010 at 8:33pm | IP Logged
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Yep, if he started an on-line class before school starts in August - my problems would be solved!!!! I'll pay whatever he charges. My problem right now is figuring out how to see everything on-line. I love what I've seen and have my husband tasked to try and show me how to do it. We signed up for auto feeds - does that mean this stuff gets stored on our computer and we can print it? I just really need stuff in print.
Janet
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AtHomeScience
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 8:12am | IP Logged
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I just came across this textbook recommendation. It is secular; has fabulous reviews on Amazon because of its visuals and writing style.
Exploring the Way Life Works
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MarilynW
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 10:28am | IP Logged
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AtHomeScience wrote:
I just came across this textbook recommendation. It is secular; has fabulous reviews on Amazon because of its visuals and writing style.
Exploring the Way Life Works |
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Kris - I looked at this in detail over the weekend and I liked it (it does have a lot of evolutionary content though). There is also a lot of good supporting information for students on the publisher's website.
The problem I have is that it would still be necessary to find spines for human biology and other topics not covered in this. Whilst I am very strong at history and lit and geography and can build my own curriculum with real books and activities - I just am not sure I can do this with science. I am praying about whether to just use a text and add in living books to add interest and quality.
I feel very happy with the Castle Heights Biology Labs. Just not sure about what main text. I did not get a chance to review the Holt book - but out of all the ones I did look at this weekend, I still liked Prentice Hall better than all the other ones.
Like Janet - I so want to get the Biology right. We have just finished our Grade 9 year which was a wonderful success - my daughter loved it - however the only subject which she did not enjoy as much was the Science - we used Abeka's Science of the Physical Creation and towards the end it was just a case of completing the text and labs with not much exploration and joy.
In retrospect I would have started Biology in Grade 9 - and then Advanced Biology in 11th. This is what I will do with my boys - and hope that I have finally found a biology spine that I like in 3 years time!
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ALmom
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 11:18am | IP Logged
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Funny thing - I have the 1998 edition of this book. Hougland and Dodson were collaborators on this version so they must have added a third collaberator since then. Maybe the newer version has more info - but from the samples I saw it was almost identical except for a glossary (very helpful if you plan to use it as a spine) and recommended booklist. I'd be hesitant to pay $75 for a book that is essentially something I already own, unless I am sure it will work and it has enough new information to warrant the purchase.
I looked at my version of The Way Life Works again. My conclusion is that it is entertaining (way more engaging than a textbook and good for a more visual person who will relate to the analogies) and does give more explanation to what is being claimed - but it's entire emphasis is on the evolutionary process and how it works. It will be very useful as a supplemental read for areas not well explained in our PH text, but not a very good stand alone spine. (I can see using this as a supplement to units on evolution and cell structure and DNA, but I don't see it as a spine because it fails to cover things I think essential to a High School Biology course - like how the various human body systems work. It doesn't address taxonomy at all. It will certainly make a lot of the cell material and DNA material in a standard text more accessible to the average person.
I would also say that it has a tone of life creating itself, not anything really blatant but I must admit it makes me a bit uncomfortable. Am I overreacting here or has someone else seen this too? I don't think it is something that would preclude me using this as a supplement from time to time, but it just isn't quite what I want in a spine.
My dh re-looked at our 1967 book and I was trying to merge the two as it really is too outdated as a stand alone. Therse was right, it is just too hard to update an older text unless you have someone like my 13 yo who is going to go off on their own to research. So after some discussion we decided that I simply do not have the time to do this and plan this well. (If my 13 yo prefers this and does start branching off researching on his own, I'll, of course, let him run with it. For my highschooler, I'd have to have everything all laid out and coordinated - and don't have the time to do that. Therefore:
My first choice is to do an online course with KASB son. I'm waiting to hear back from him about that course. If he does not offer it this year, then our fallback plan is:
1) Use Prentice Hall with Kolbe lesson plans, non honor track to cut out the fluff and get to the essentials and reorder according to the science advisors suggestions to emphasize and do first what I want to do best.(I guess it really is the best secular text out there. Oh, and one reason other dd had such a hard time with it is that we did Biology first with her and she had no chemistry background from Physical science when we approached this, so a whole bunch of the material was over her head. Having done the Physical Science already with the boys, I'm hoping this will take care of a lot of our previous problems in understanding) Maybe we can share ideas as we go along, if you are still using this Marilyn. My highschooler likes Kolbe plans and this is all laid out even if it is a bit bookish. The Catholic pov is woven into the plans and I really don't have time right now to do anything else unless a magical spine turns up. I'm okay if the 13 yo finds this tedious, I'll let him branch off however he wants - doing whatever. I know he'll learn tons. My oldest wants things planned to the t- so Kolbe it will be unless we get into KASB son's class.
2) If I have time, I will at least line up some chapters between the 1967 and PH texts for my own reading and to give the children a sense of the science of Biology. The history really does bring Biology alive for me and helps me see and understand the process better. I will share some of these insights with the children.
3) When it comes to the chemistry of things, the cell structure and DNA, we may take a break and read from something else to make it more accessible, especially if I sense that oldest is doing the memorize forget routine. I will try to do that anywhere we get stumped and will count on you ladies to recommend a quick read resource to help me if we get stumped on something I was unprepared for.
Marilyn, I think I'm going to go back and look at the lab you chose. What do you think of it? If I have a good lab to illustrate some things, that would help a lot.
4) We will use KASB son's material, if I can find a way to print it, and use this as a guick overview read to present to younger children once per week and as an introduction to our main text for the highschooler. (I think - but I have to get a paper copy for me and see if it lines up as well as I think it might)
We will use our charts for taxonomy and couple this study with our nature observation (and hopefully be able to order some things from the recommended places where you can see samples of things in all the different categories - even ones where we don't have access or are microscopic) We may not get through every heading, etc. but at least have some systematic exposure to the process of taxonomy. I will read from the history to see where it has been and so my children will know how the purpose of this has shifted and be exposed to its ongoing shifting. But the emphasis will be on observation as far as we are able - obviously some of the DNA stuff that drives the charts now is beyond our ability to observe, but we will at least talk about it and just avoid anything controversial right at the moment in this (the funky bird the PH text mentions we'll just brush off with - they are re-ordering things by what they find in the DNA and if you pursue this further and begin to look closely at DNA, you can enter the debate).
Am I sounding more on base now?
Please join me in praying that KASB's son really does launch his on-line Biology and my children can take that. Otherwise it will be a bit of a textbooky course by time necessity and I'll have to watch more carefully for the memorize forget stuff - but it is the best I am able to do without help right now and we'll just have to make the best of it. I may use the course, not only for science, but for study skills and guessing what might be on a test and ...  Maybe we'll outline chapters as a means of organizing information and highlighting what of all the stuff they throw at you is really important. It may work as a good basic schooly skills course.
Janet
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AtHomeScience
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 11:19am | IP Logged
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Since Abeka is an anti-Catholic company I personally avoid it (though I know several Catholics who use it.) I'm looking for a book with a solid explanation of Evolution without mixing in discussions of religion, and without typical textbook writing, so for me this is a perfect find! I also have the advantage of having a strong human biology background, so that is less important for me to have in a spine.
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AtHomeScience
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You can get it used much cheaper. I ordered a copy from my library. I think the molecular stuff is the hardest to understand in terms of both structures and processes. Taxonomy is straight forward, and there's a wealth of human biology resources.
Having everything in one book or course would be great. So far the Hippocampus resources are the only ones I've found. It seems we all have different levels of sensitivities regarding Evolution making it hard to make recommendations.
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lapazfarm
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 12:24pm | IP Logged
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AtHomeScience wrote:
I just came across this textbook recommendation. It is secular; has fabulous reviews on Amazon because of its visuals and writing style.
Exploring the Way Life Works |
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This is most likely what I will use for my son when we get to advanced bio in 11th grade. We did tons of taxonomy and anatomy in his marine biology course this year, so advanced biology for him will focus on the molecular, cellular, and evolutionary processes side of things, which this book is perfect for.
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| Posted: June 15 2010 at 12:42pm | IP Logged
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Kris, you are so fortunate to have the science background. I think when you have the background and confidence, it is easier to use things from whatever pov, because you already have answers/ have come to conclusions and know how to present things in your house and you are confident that you will recognize error and be able to handle it - so the interest level is more important. When you don't have a science background, you have to at least feel like you'll be able to recognize and address any error - or someone else has done some of this for you. Because I don't have a lot of science background, I don't want to present error - either way - in my house. If error is there, I must address it - but what if I'm not even confident I'll recognize it or know what it is? I try to present evidence and make sure we know clearly what the church teaches. I figure my children will come back and explain it all to me someday.
In the meantime, I don't want to overemphasize what I know I'm incapable of addressing and would rather let the scientists finish hashing it out between them and when the evidence can be presented with a respect for faith, then I'll be more confident. I'm not forming any definite opinion at this point, just trying to look honestly at evidence and wish it wasn't such an emotional debate out there. I'm more confident if the evidence is presented from someone who shares my faith (faith and reason do not contradict)because I know where they are coming from and less likely to be dealing with hidden agendas I might not recognize. I'm afraid I'd miss things - even when stuff sounds fairly logical, I'm just not sure because I don't trust and it takes me months to answer simple questions that come up. I've seen such emotionally, agenda driven material, that I do have some reason for being cautious. I have lots of questions but most of these have to wait until they aren't taken as a challenge or rejection of something, but for what they are - an honest, inquiring mind that wants to know why.
Because of who I am and where I'm at with my own science background, I try to pass on at least the inquiry and desire to understand, to be open minded and present the possibilities and let my children know that there are controversies and debates being raged out there. I try to de-emphasize what I haven't determined for myself and try to emphasize more those things in science that we are able to tackle well. I want to give the children a foundation so that as faith filled people interested in science, they can one day enter the fray and explain it all to me.
I didn't find taxonomy straight forward at all. The last time I tried to tackle it on my own, I derailed our science study for many, many months. I ended up frustrated, going off on a 3 month tangent searching on-line and no one bothered to explain why the changes -until Therese kindly filled me in that the DNA and evolution were driving the changes. I was looking on websites even (unheard of for me) and getting more and more confused by the minute. Of course the last time I took a science class or even thought about that kind of thing, we only had 3 kindgoms and it was all based on what you could observe yourself. I was thrown by the PH text and its throwing out of things that sounded really bizzare to me (some bird they were putting with something else that had no observable similiarities that I was aware of and I wanted to know why). Being a detail freak and researcher, I was on the hunt for an explanation. I was put out by the scientific communities and textbooks failure to really cite evidence - nowhere did anyone explain the basis for the arguements or disagreements among scientists - not even a hint of why. I was expecting someone somewhere to have at least presented a synopsis of what they found that supported this new position for this crazy bird.
On-line, I found a lot of places in the taxonomy with TBD as the critter - no explanation. It used to be, when something new was claimed, great care was taken to describe the process of determining this and the conclusions and a scientist with access to equipment could replicate this. There were statements claiming different numbers of kingdoms, adding domains, etc. but nothing that said what scientific information was suggesting this (I don't claim that the additional kingdoms are wrong or anything - I just want to understand what was discovered to bring this about - thanks to Therese I was able to have a general laymans sense - but still would love to see and read the scientific debates - surely they are there somewhere archived, right?) I always thought that was part of the scientific method. The old texts did a good job of explaining the whys - but suddenly now this doesn't seem to be done for the layman at all - at least not in a systematic way. It is all more catch as catch can. It was very, very frustrating for me. Looking at the old science book, they systematically described the experiments (even though these could not be replicated in a high school, they were detailed enough that it was clear what the evidence was). This is what I want to see. I know it is out there somewhere - but it is very disorganized. My scientists better know how to write and argue coherantly; how to present their findings systematically with clear and elegant language. Scientists who can explain things to the layman are sorely needed, in my opinion. The authors of The Way Life Works at least make clear what they are trying to say. I really do appreciate that.
I am not telling my children what to think. We are clear on what the church teaches - from there it all depends on the evidence. I am humble enough to know that I don't understand science well enough to form any opinion yet. But it is hard to find things that present non-emotional evidence. It is a huge emotional let me tell you what you should think fiasco from what I have seen. I liked my old text and even The Way Life Works as attempts to try and make some of this accessible - and I plan to use these. But I just cannot build my high school Biology course with an entire emphasis on evolution because of my own limits and because I happen to think other things are more important to the average person, too. (And I need organized texts of some sort to help me correlate what is different now and why).
If I had a strong science background, I'm sure my emphasis or approach might be different. I don't think it is so much a matter of sensitivity as it is an acknowledgement of how equipped you are to guide the process. If there was someone I knew and trusted with the science background to guide the process, I'd be jumping up and down happy and would delegate for my children's sakes. Until God provides me with that person, we do the best we are able. I'd rather my children remain inquisitive and open than for me to try and tell them what all this stuff means that would take me years of research to sort through. Even worse would be to accidently delegate and have them taught blatant error and have their inquisitiveness squelched. A text like what KASB's son is planning to write, really will fill a desperate need for non-science folks trying to tackle science in a world that is rapidly losing the ability to even reason.
I last took a science course in early 1970 - and since then most of my science exposure comes from the media - not very reliable science. (I did have a science teacher tell me that the world was running out of water and scientists were looking at dry ice as a water substitute - sounds bizzare to me and if that is what scientists really were looking at, I think I had reason to wonder if they'd lost their mind. We also listened to endless tapes of Ralph Nader in science class).
Trying to provide science in my home with my clearly deplorable background is really a tough road. Obviously I'm reading more now - but at the same time I've been doing vision therapy, teaching, nursing, having babies, trying to meet the emotional needs of teens and toddlers at the same time, guide a college process, ..... and most of this starting when nothing Catholic was really out there unless you had out of print books from the 1950s. There is only so much a human being is capable of doing. I have to be realistic with my time. Whatever we manage will have to be good enough - and I have come to learn to trust that either the child is not a science fan and the attitude of questioning will serve them well and the learning how to learn or they are science fans in which case they will work at filling in any gaps I leave from sheer interest and delight. They often come back and explain things to me. At some point, we just do what we have to do.
It doesn't mean I don't stress big time over science every single year.
Janet
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MarilynW
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Janet - I echo much of what you say. I think the longer I homeschool the more I realize my limitations - and that sometimes "good enough" has to replace "perfect." I am also seeing that reinventing the wheel is not always a good thing - that spending time with my children and teaching them to learn is almost more important than the content or curriculum. No point stressing over and discussing curriculum and not having the time to actually do anything. Maybe for me for science it would be better to use a solid program like Kolbe and add to it and really discuss things with my daughter encourage her to want to explore various things. And above all with science maybe for me it has to be "just do it?"
On another note completely - have you ever checked out Real Science by Gravitas. I have heard it is world view neutral - I am going to look at it for my younger ones. It might be good for your 13 year old.
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lapazfarm
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Janet, I really love your candor and your humility. The ability to recognize and admit one's limitations (due to experience, education, or whatever reason) is a gift we would all do well to cultivate.
I know I feel about history much as you do about science. I am extremely limited in my knowledge of history and I have to depend on the knowledge of others to support my decision-making in this area. I don't like to, but I have to be humble enough to admit I need help in this area. Meanwhile, I am reading (and reading and reading)and educating myself to make better decisions on my own in the future.
I think your decision to go with Kolbe and Prentice Hall is a good one. If you can put your trust in them to handle biology, then you can use you energies in other areas where your particular expertise can shine.
Oh, how I wish we could all get together and share our combined talents with our children! What an awesome coop that would be!
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Why not go with something like Apologia, and when they get into their creationist/young earth stuff, just branch out and do some research and reading on other theories? Tie it in with what the Catholic Church does teach and all the different possibilities. Their texts read beautifully and make the difficult material so much easier to understand. Just my opinion.
They also have great labs. As far as completing both the regular biology and Human Anatomy in one year, I've heard of people who do that. Personally, I would think it would be a lot for the average student. Someone really into science probably would have no problem doing that.
Sometimes I think that we try to reinvent the wheel. But I know what you mean how there just isn't one ideal source for a Catholic biology text. It boggles the mind that there isn't. I'm guessing that Catholic schools use either Christian texts or secular, and make sure to discuss the Catholic Church's teachings.
Good luck with whatever you decide. 
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ALmom
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Woo Hoo. Is there a happy dancing icon?
I just got an e-mail back from KASB's son. He will have an on-line Biology class (geared to 9th) ready by August at latest. He will make sure the material is posted so that we can print things that are to be read. The review questions - they'll have to do on-line. I think the boys can handle it without undue eyestrain. The Life of Life is being put into book form for the end of the year. I'm first in line for a copy.
The description of his course that he gave me in his e-mail is covering just what I wanted covered - and with all the emphasis I wanted. There will be 4 days of readings on line and then a day off for the students to either do labs or additional readings.
I think I may take the course alongside my boys and they can help me along.
I am just so relieved to be done with traditional science textbooks for a year. (This almost sounds funny coming from me - the plan fanatic.) I already have a lot of supplemental reading and with ordering the Castle heights lab book - seems like we should be set for the year!
Oh, Theresa, you were so kind in your comments. I'm still bungling. I'm sure I'll be back to bugging you next year about Chemistry and I am half serious about saving your plans to sell.
Oh and just so you know - those 40 year old textbooks in chemistry are really grand. I have no idea how my 13 you did it, but he somehow figured out what had and had not changed. He spent one afternoon trying to explain it to me. That is actually when I learned that the periodic table is different since I took chemistry.  (My 16 would have just done the book and been glad to be done so he would have been relegated to being stuck in outdated science). I probably could have handed my 13 my 1967 Biology and seen what he did with it - he would have been fine. He's not the one I'm stressing over about science. He has taught me the joys of unschooling at least in a child's passions. I will be keeping my eyes open for some ancient book that describes the first microscope. If I lay that out, ds 13 will be off building his own and trying to improve it and researching how microscopes have changed and ... one thing will lead to another. Anyone know of plans for a centrifuge? (He loved a field trip he took where they got to help in the extraction of DNA from a strawberry or some such). Of course our homemade version won't quite do the trick - but all the learning in the trying.
Anyways, thought I'd pass on the news in case anyone else out there is looking for what I was.
Janet
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That's wonderful news! Let me know when he has it ready so I can talk it up on my blog. From what I've seen it should be fabulous!
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Theresa/Kris/Anyone
I just read about this book - All Creatures Great and Small by Michael Spear. It is in the Emmanuel Books catalog - and appears to be a pro-life Life Science text written by a Catholic. I think that MODG may use it.
Does anyone have any views on it? Does it stand alone? Maybe needs to be combined with something else?
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Karen T
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I have used All Creatures Great and Small and would not consider it a high school level course at all. And it's boring to boot. No labs, just some suggestions like "start an insect collection". All black and white, read the text and answer questions at the end. I used it in 7th grade and it was OK but definitely not high school. I haven't heard of anyone liking it either. Sorry.
karen
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Marilyn:
I tried to use it in 8th with my oldest. It and Physics Made Simple and my inability to teach science destroyed any desire she ever had for doing science. (Her last few years of college she finally recovered some and was resparked into some aspects with Medical Incredibles - but beyond that she wants no part of science, still).
Part of it with the Speare book was ignorant me - but it did seem disorganized, and without a science background youself, it just doesn't give you enough help. In the section where they discussed some chemistry as if you were already thoroughly familiar with the periodic table and what all those numbers mean is fresh on your mind, they didn't even have a periodic table for reference. (Ok, you can go out and get those easily enough) but they were assuming you already knew a lot of stuff that we did not know. It may have improved since we tried it those long years ago. It was pro-life and the people who found it fun to use were folks with a lot of confidence with science - not me. (I told you I've tried everything under the sun. Things that others think is pretty decent, hasn't worked for me just because I need things very systematic and explained for me).
Janet
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Thanks so much Janet and Karen - I appreciate your opinions.
I am taking a break next week from school planning - my annual summer "retreat" to pray for guidance on all school choices for each child. I am looking forward to finding some peace in all my decisions - and maybe some divine revelation on a biology program!!!
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Posts: 927
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| Posted: June 18 2010 at 2:46pm | IP Logged
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Janet, it is not you at all. I do have a heavy science background, and I still thought that book was awful. We got through it and ds was able to answer the questions at the end of each chapter but it did nothing to increase his desire to learn science either. I was surprised when MODG started including it.
karen
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4Real Forums : Exploring God's Creation in Nature and Science
Topic: high school biology
