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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 9:01pm | IP Logged
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I know there are lots of threads on similar topics, but I am putting out this plea before I *hopefully* retire for the evening.
My 3.5 yr old dd and my just turned 2 ds are driving me, and all of us, up a wall. They fight almost all day. Nothing I got for Christmas seemed to help. When they aren't killing each other they are getting into something. I am more tolerant of ds since he is still so little and she is usually the instigator. He does do his share of antagonizing her, though.
Dd is just plain difficult all the way around. It seems she cries all day, making demands, taking people's things, whining, etc. I have tried the "poor thing needs more focused attention" approach, the "poor thing needs more consistent discipline" approach, the "poor thing needs more sleep" approach, and the "poor thing needs something constructive to do" approach. I am getting close to the "poor thing needs another home" approach!
Please, suggestions, or just empathy and prayers! I feel like I am always yelling at her these days, when not using one of my loving approaches, of course.  Three is always a hard age for me and my kids, and she definitely has reason to be jealous of her very cute, doted-upon by siblings, little brother.
Help me love my little darling again! 
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In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
Remembering Today
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 9:10pm | IP Logged
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btdt.. the best news is... they do get bigger and older 
though tonight it's the year and a half year old that I'm less than happy with.. I was sitting on the couch and he was next to me.. I had a book in both hands and he took a dive at me.. his head hit my nose with nothing to buffer.. this was about an hour ago and my nose still hurts and theres a spot on the side he hit that has a bump and bruise   Another "it's a good thing they're so cute moment"
Have you tried "the poor thing needs more gross motor activity" strategy yet?
I know it's cold but seriously, if they're not in imminent danger of frostbite, and mine are getting like that, they go outside.. the cold only drains energy from them faster and they're much happy children when they come back in.. even if they're only out 10 or 15 minutes.
Another possible strategy is the "add water to change mood" strategy.. a bath, with an older child to oversee.. or playing in the sink (floor covered in towels if necessary) can really change an attitude.. not sure why but a water activity is more than just another activity.
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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KauaiCatholic
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 9:12pm | IP Logged
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oh Molly, praying for you! and your precious daughter. 
(hopefully wiser moms will have good suggestions ... I can only offer sympathetic cyber-hugs and prayers.)
HANG IN THERE!
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 Viviane
Grateful mama of Jonah Augustine ('01), Sophia Marie ('05) and Luke Dominic ('10)
We can do no great things; only small things with great love. -- Blessed Teresa of Calcutta
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jdostalik
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 9:18pm | IP Logged
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Molly,
My almost three year old is driving me mad quite a bit and he doesn't have a partner in crime like yours does.
I am praying for you. Jodie's suggestion of bath time play works for me A LOT--as well as pulling out a special toy that he hasn't seen in a bit...but I don't have the fighting you mention--that would be hard.
No real advice but lots of commiseration! Hugs to you!
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God Bless,
Jennifer in TX
wife to Bill, mom to six here on earth and eight in heaven.
Let the Little Ones Come
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teachingmyown
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 9:29pm | IP Logged
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I bought them a Jump-o-lene for Christmas which they LOVED for a couple of days, but they seemed to have killed it! I am hoping dh can take a look at it tomorrow and get it pumped back up.
She probably does need more outside time, even her outdoor loving sister hasn't been going out in this cold. I will try the water play idea. I bought just about every form of molding/sculpting/make a wonderful mess things for Christmas and her attention span is about ten minutes.
The problem is when they get so irritating that it's hard to see them as cute and lovable. I doesn't help when I really just want her to settle down so I can get on with my plans.  She should be my plans.
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In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
Remembering Today
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JodieLyn
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Well Molly it could be worse.. like the time my 3 yr old son climbed into the rafters of the garage, no ladder and was tossing rotated out toys down to the other kids.
Or the time the same 3 yr old boy with his instigating 18 mo old sister managed in the less than 5 minutes it took to put the baby down, to paint my kitchen floor with blue and green food coloring.
Or when my then 2 yr old son dumped the last bit of olive oil on the cement patio of the house we were renting.. moments before my ILs were to arrive.
If you give me time I'm sure I can think of more. that pair of brother and sister.. 20 months apart.. have been the worst and best pair.. they get along great but usually be creating the worst messes/situations.
And the good news is that we all survived it.. they're no where near as bad at 11 and 9 as they were at 1.5 and 3
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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Chris V
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 10:41pm | IP Logged
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Molly ~ you've got some great support here! And some fantastic suggestions from others (which I don't mind a bit implementing in my own home for my sort-of-similar circumstance  ). But prayers from me you've got.
My motto is "Am I doing all that I can to bring out the best in my children?". And when I go to sleep at night, to make sure that there is *no doubt* in their hearts just how much their Mama loves them. That's all that matters. The rest of the bugs will work themselves out...eventually
...this too, shall pass...
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Chris
Happy Wife with my Happy Life
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Kathryn
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| Posted: Jan 08 2010 at 11:56pm | IP Logged
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teachingmyown wrote:
I am getting close to the "poor thing needs another home" approach!
Please, suggestions, or just empathy and prayers!
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Here's to you from another mom who's thought that line before but unfortunately has no words of wisdom to provide...only empathy and prayers! 
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Kathryn in TX
(dd 16, ds 15, dd 8, dd 5)
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stellamaris
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Prayers for you, Molly! These are challenging ages; be sure to take a little peek at them when (and if!) they are sleeping. It warms a mom's heart and helps us get beyond all the negative tensions of the day.
Jodie, I had to laugh at your stories! I remember when my 4,4, and 2 1/2 year olds (all partners in crime..did I ever feel out-numbered!) got into our "school room", scaled the shelves to the very top, and proceeded to throw ALL the math manipulatives, games, and everything else with a gadzillion small parts on the floor. My dh and I were blissfully having our coffee in bed (early morning) thinking they were playing nicely in the family room, until I felt, like Miss Clavel, something "was not right"! Hysterical laughter drifting from the school room drew me there only to see a 2-foot deep pile of little pieces of former well-organized learning materials all over the floor. It wasn't too funny at the time , but now we really get a great laugh talking about it!
Hang in there, Molly. I know it seems like this tough phase will never end, but it will.
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In Christ,
Caroline
Wife to dh 30+ yrs,ds's 83,85,89,dd's 91,95,ds's 01,01,02,grammy to 4
Flowing Streams
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MNMommy
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More from me. My youngest two are 20 months apart, and my youngest is 20mo right now. I look at how lovable and darling she is, and realize that I never felt those same feelings toward my 3yo at the same age. He always seemed to be antagonizing me in some way, and my frustration with him was mirrored in the other kids' reactions to him.
I have worked so hard to get over those feelings toward him and treat him like he deserves. We FINALLY have found our way to a close loving relationship, and the entire family is benefitting immensely.
Not to say that my situation is the same as yours, but all those frustrated feelings came rushing back when I read through your post. I know how difficult it can be.
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Jennifer
Tired mom to - 10yo dd, 7yo ds, 6yo ds, 4yo dd, 2yo ds
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DivineMercy
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Molly,
Prayers and hugs for you so much from another mom going through similar things. For me, my just turned 2 and my almost 4 year old are like oil and water. They pick-pick-pick at each other all day. It doesn't help that my 2 year old's default reaction to everything is to let out a high pitched squeal as loud as his lungs will let him!
I appreciate all the help as well.
Michelle
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amyable
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The best thing that happened to my 3yo who was like that is that she turned FOUR. She is still a very choleric, prickly child, but she is WORLDS better than she was at 3. Of course my dd is not your dd, but I'll share what helped here in case it will help there!
This dd actually does need more sleep. She's the kind of kid that wakes up at 5 AM thinking she's raring to go, but she is out of steam by 8 AM and uses her negative energy to keep herself awake and "crazy" until it's time for nap (back when she was 3) or bedtime (now that she is 4). We are still learning, but we are trying to work with her personal rhythms to make sure she gets the sleep she needs.
I had to stop getting stern and especially yelling at her. Now, this kid needs lots of discipline and I in no way stopped that - but she was SO feeding off my anger and frustration, even if I only showed it a little. I still send her to her room or whatever, but I must do it with raised eyebrows and a very calm demeanor (this is so hard for me!) instead of trying to be stern with the growly voice and the knitted brow (or especially the yelling and anything else related!). I must maintain MY self control with her.
Last, she needs a TON of is physical touch. Just holding her. Rubbing her back, and not showing any frustration when she asks me to do that for the Nth time that day. LOTS AND LOTS of good eye contact when she is talking to me. Always smiling when she comes in the room (no matter what I'm thinking about her!). I really think this child thought I didn't love her because I was always stern, because she was always in trouble! It was a horrible cycle.
I'll be praying for your sake that your dd matures quickly!
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Amy
mom of 5, ages 6-16, and happy wife of 
The Highly Sensitive Homeschooler
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drmommy
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| Posted: Jan 09 2010 at 9:04am | IP Logged
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I had such a good laugh..sorry!
My children are a little older, but my girls used to fight...then I as a "punishment" they would have to hug each other, not let go, and say a Hail Mary until the end together. By the time the Hail Mary was done, they would be giggling. It worked for us, helped them to memorize prayers, etc. I physically cannot yell (sometimes wish I could), so I had to come up with something. Also, I would just walk over, take the toy, and say, "everyone's done". Walk away again, and ignore the crying. After 30 seconds I would come up with "who wants to help Mommy with something fun?" and then give them a little chore like folding towels or something.
I don't know...these are great suggestions here. Mine are older, so it WILL pass ( 17, 12,10, and 7). It just gets mouthier!! Then it is easy...just take away priviledges and make it THEIR choice!
God Bless you for being such a good Mommy.
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Lara Sauer
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| Posted: Jan 09 2010 at 9:26am | IP Logged
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Molly...did my three year old Lucy move into your house without my noticing?
No advice...just a lot of commiseration!
Case in point...I went to Mass on Monday, and was gone for all of 35 minutes. When I came back, Lucy had covered Gretchen (15 months), herself, the hardwood floor in the living room, and the leather couch in marker! All while her 12 year old sister was sitting at the dining room table with her back to the chaos!
Lucy is silent, but lethal! However, when I came in, she was trying to "clean" up her mess with baby wipes! I took that as a sign from God that there is hope...and light at the end of the tunnel.
And yes...it was permanent marker...Gretchen is still sporting some pretty attactive green streaks in her hair...
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Chris V
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amyable wrote:
| The best thing that happened to my 3yo who was like that is that she turned FOUR. She is still a very choleric, prickly child, but she is WORLDS better than she was at 3. |
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 I only quoted the above, but I could easily have written this post myself, regarding my own daughter, who is now (thankfully) 5 years old and almost an entirely different little girl!
... I share such a similar story, even right down to the way I responded to her!
It's actually quite comforting to hear others' stories of their own daily struggles, we're out numbered by our littles, and need all the support we can get! 
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Chris
Happy Wife with my Happy Life
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LLMom
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DO they play better without each other around? My 2 youngest are 19 months apart and they were the way you describe. I would put the oldest of the two with my older dc in one room and the youngest one with me. I bascially didn't let them play together if they were doing that. I don't know if that is ever an option. I would switch them around so I got to spend time with both of them. I used my older dc a lot.
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For veteran & former homeschool moms
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mary theresa
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Oh, I'm so glad that other people's 3 year olds are difficult too! I thought that 2 was supposed to be the "terrible" age, but I like my two year old way better than my 3.5 yr old right now! My three year old exhausts me in a way that my rambunctious sassy 2 yr old still doesn't. I can't WAIT for 4 . . . here's hoping something will magically change!
I am trying really hard to hide how much she irks me. I try to find one on one time with her (as she is WAY better one on one with me) and invite her to do things with me/help me with stuff. Maybe a trip to the grocery store with just her and me in the evening where she gets to pick out the things we need. Or an extra book before nap because "I love reading with you!" I have recently been trying the smiling at her more tack (like Amy suggested). It seems to be helping . . a bit . . . SOME days. Sorry, not much help here
Anyways, to all of you. I'm so glad and grateful to have this place of support from all of you good mommies have the same difficulties as I and its not just that something is wrong with me or my child specfically, you know?
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Mary Theresa
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pmeilaen
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I just saw a book at our public library that addresses these "ankle-biters." It's called Have a New Kid by Friday. The author has his own website: Dr. Kevin Leman. A book that stresses the importance of sleep and behavior is The 7 O'Clock Bedtime. Hope this helps.
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Eva
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teachingmyown
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Well, Jodie, you are right it could be worse. Possibly, it has been worse with my other children. Someday, I will look back at this and laugh. Just not right now.
I took her to the library with me, a special one on one, and if I took my hand off of her, she would bolt down the aisle. I sit separately with her at Mass sometimes because she and Seth cannot be together. She is still so terrible. I try to cuddle her and just give her so much attention but nothing works. We took her to her big brother's basketball game, again-it was just her, and she wouldn't listen from the moment we got there. I lie down with her at night, sing, tell stories, etc. The moment I say goodnight (she will not fall asleep with me in the room) she screams and demands things. Big sigh...
Today was just another day of one or both of them screaming. The older kids try to help, but they often end up yelling too. What a great place to be!
I have put a book on hold at the library that hopefully help with her speech. No one can understand most of what she says. So, maybe that is a frustration and the book will help. But really, I see a devious look in her eyes when she starts acting up. It is hard to feel sorry for her.
One other thought I had when comparing her to other three year olds that I have had. Since she is number seven, and life is so busy, I NEED her to behave more than when I just had littles and they were my only focus. Maybe she senses this?
Eva, I am going to look for that book. Is this the one that advertises on the radio? I never thought I would need it, but I need something!
Thanks, Ladies! At least I am not alone here.
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In Christ,
Molly
wife to Court & mom to ds '91, dd '96, ds '97, dds '99, '01, '03, '06, and dss '07 and 01/20/11
Remembering Today
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JodieLyn
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I was just hoping you could laugh at the past mishaps.
I would definately look into her speech if it's causing her that much frustration. You didn't mention what book from the library, but the book from NATHHAN called Straight Talk is helpful.
You also mentioned in another thread that your house was cold (feeling cold to you and to the kids). Could she be reacting to that?
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
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4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: My wit's end!
