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Natalia
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1)Do you do any kind of vocabulary program? I used to do Wordly Wise with my dd but once I started to rely more on narration, dictation and copy work I dropped the workbooks. Now I am wondering if I should go back to them or if I should have my ds (8) do any kind of vocabulary work.
2)What do you use for spelling? Anybody uses Spelling Power?
Natalia
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alicegunther
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Reading great books is the best vocabulary program. It truly works, is fun for all, and teaches naturally, painlessly, and permanently. Since you are already reading and asking the children for narration, dictation and copywork, I would say you are already all set and do not need a separate program.
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tovlo4801
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Natalia,
The other day we tried something here that was kind of fun. I think it was on the Bravewriter blog.
I asked the kids to look through their books or magazines and find a few words they were unfamiliar with. My 5 yo did this too. Then we got out the dictionary and looked up the meanings of the words together. It was fun and sometimes looking up one meaning lead us to looking up another word. We got sidetracked by interesting words we didn't know at the top of the dictionary page sometimes too. A couple of the words we chose were words we kind of knew the meaning to, but weren't sure exactly. It gave us the chance to talk about understanding the meaning of a word in context and then seeing all the different shades of meaning that we might not have picked up from the reading.
For my 5 yo, he picked the words cheetah and supersaver from his most recent Big Backyard magazine. He carefully wrote out his words copying them from the magazine. We worked on how to look up words in the dictionary. Mostly I flipped through the pages and he told me when I'd gotten to the right beginning letter. Because supersaver is not a word we found in his beginning dictionary we talked about compound words and looked up the meaning of super and the meaning of saver and then talked about what those two words together probably meant. Then he cut out his little book and put it together and we read about how animals save up food for the winter.
It was actually really fun and I hope it gave the kids the idea that there will always be unfamiliar words in our reading and it's kind of an adventure to look them up. I told my oldest that we'd do this every so often and if he didn't want to go searching for words when we did it he could just keep a sheet of paper as a bookmark in his reading and when he found an unfamiliar word he could add it to the bookmark so the searching part would already be done. He's not doing it yet, but it works either way.
BTW I did this with them too. I got out a papal encyclical I had been reading. There are always unfamiliar words there for me. Even gave us a chance to look up the latin (turned out greek) roots of the word deacon on a weird trail from of the word diakonia (I think?). Dictionary was of no use. We had to go to the internet for that one. 
Just an idea. God Bless.
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Sarah
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I use Spelling Power with my 4th grader.However, I don't do it like it say to because I just don't do well with systems like that. I do a pretest, have him write the words he misses. Then eventually retest and possibly make sentences with them and some cursive practice. That works for us. Have you used it?
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Natalia
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Yes. I am using this year with both my 12 dd and my 8 ds. I am not sure if I do it the way they recommend because it will take too long to read all their instructions!
This is what I do:
1. Dictate the word list
2. What they misspell they write on the right side of the page.
3. If they miss five words I stop and they study those words
4. Next time I call out those words they missed before going on with
new ones.
I probably should keep a record of problem words but I haven't so far. My son has some problems with getting the spelling and I am not sure if it is the program or if it is normal. Time will tell.
Natalia
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Sarah
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I agree about the directions. After you said that I remembered that as being a reason for not doing the whole program. Last year when my son was 8 it didn't go as smoothly as it is going this year-he's 9. He likes it better and now considers it one of his favorite things to do as far as schoolwork is concerned. I think I do it about the same as you do. I just really like a list of words to read from and sometimes I mix lists if he knows most of the words from the first. I definately don't retest if he's got it!
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Erin
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alicegunther wrote:
| Reading great books is the best vocabulary program. It truly works, is fun for all, and teaches naturally, painlessly, and permanently. |
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I would like to really second Alice's advice here. My children are passionate readers. And I can hear that reflected in their speech. As one ds said about his sister, "Chiara never uses a short word when she can use a long one." If they read good literature, there is no need for vocab workbooks.
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alicegunther
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Erin wrote:
| As one ds said about his sister, "Chiara never uses a short word when she can use a long one." If they read good literature, there is no need for vocab workbooks. |
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What a great quote from your ds! I love it!
And it reminds me of another point I meant to mention. If children learn the words in context through literature, they are much more likely to incorporate these new and novel words into their own speech and writing than if they encountered them in a list.
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Kelly
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One way my parents helped improve our vocabulary was "talking in code". Whenever they wanted to discuss something that they didn't necessairily want to share with the world, they'd simply use the biggest, most alien words available. For example, instead of "Daniel wants to take a walk" they'd say, "The eldest progeny expresses desire to perambulate". Obviously, you don't want to do this with issues of highly sensative nature, but for general discussions that aren't for everyone, it REALLY works. Just watch how the children tune into vocabulary!
Kelly in the Southernmost peninsula of sub-tropical clime
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Natalia
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I am glad of your reassurance. I have a good vocabulary in Spanish and English and I acquire it by reading. My kids like to read but are not the voracious readers I was. I don't worry about my 8yos, he already has a great vocabulary and uses it frequently My dd (12) on the other hand has an O.K vocabulary but I notice she has trouble sometimes expressing what she wants to say. I don't know if it is just the way she is - she might be reluctant to express her opinions- or if she lacks the tools to do it. KWIM?
Natalia
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Anne Marie M
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I've started using a spelling program. . . and it hasn't fallen by the wayside yet! We're using Andrew Pudewa's spelling program (don't have the exact name in front of me). I'm using it for my kids who aren't naturally good spellers (my oldest was fine without any program). It's about 10 minutes a day and based on CDs. I'm thrilled to find something we can actually stick with!]
Anne Marie
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Erin
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In relation to spelling we have tried a new track this year. Although my children read extensively they were not good spellers. Rally I believe a large pert of this is they do not write much. That's a whole new area to tackle. 
Two terms ago we started being consistent here. We use CHC spelling and DAILY they now do copywork. I started real easy using Nursery Rhymes. Then on the day after they have dictation on the piece they had copied the day previously.
I had tried parts of this previously but I really believe the studied dictation was the final key. And the consistency. Now the children get all their words correct at the end of the week. However that does not mean that they always spell correctly when writing, (however infrequently that is ) but I am noticing a big improvement and dd12 especially is taking more note and care of her spelling.
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Tina P.
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Erin wrote:
In relation to spelling we have tried a new track this year. Although my children read extensively they were not good spellers. Rally I believe a large pert of this is they do not write much. That's a whole new area to tackle.
Two terms ago we started being consistent here. We use CHC spelling and DAILY they now do copywork. I started real easy using Nursery Rhymes. Then on the day after they have dictation on the piece they had copied the day previously.
I had tried parts of this previously but I really believe the studied dictation was the final key. And the consistency. Now the children get all their words correct at the end of the week. However that does not mean that they always spell correctly when writing, (however infrequently that is ) but I am noticing a big improvement and dd12 especially is taking more note and care of her spelling. |
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I have the same problems with spelling as you do, Erin. How do you determine what their spelling lists consist of? Right now we use McGraw Hill Spectrum spelling, which I like because it incorporates a little creative writing and a little grammar into the program. And when I think about it, I think possibly we might be doing too much because I have separate grammar, which also incorporates a little writing. Then vocabulary is separate, reading is separate...
OK. Here's the big question. How do you all narrow your subjects down to the essentials?
Anyway, getting back on track, with our spelling, the kids do one page a day. It's simple, can't possibly take more than 10 minutes per day. Then on Friday, they take a quiz/test on the words. But if you could clue me in on how to find lists of words that are progressive and age-appropriate, I would surely like to try your method.
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ALmom
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We have used the Writing Road to Reading to get lists and to place children. I don't do the whole system as it is defined, but it helps us know where to start in the lists and does have a convenient dialogue/dictation that helps the children be successful. Also it helps me know when there is a rule I can explain that helps the children extrapolate to other words. I do this with my severely deficient spellers ( a 5th grader that is spelling about 2 grade). I just use CHC spelling for those that seem OK with spelling but just need a little reinforcement.
In either case, I don't retest words if they get it the first dictation time. I add missed words to later tests and keep a running list of troublesome words - especially if there is a pattern where reinforcement of a spelling rule or phonogram would help.
Janet
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Erin
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[QUOTE=Tina P.]
How do you determine what their spelling lists consist of? .......OK. Here's the big question. How do you all narrow your subjects down to the essentials?
QUOTE]
Tina,
I use the list from their CHC spelling. Another idea we have used at times is using words that they commonly misspell. I find that they can sometimes spell the hard words correctly but not the easy ones. ie. went, where. They will often spell incorrectly so we may have a period where I will use these words for the week or so.
I did have a book that was really old written by Schonell and I used this before CHC the children like it. Maybe there would be something on the internet?
What your doing sounds fine, but I do find that consistency is really important here, at least for mine. Also I believe the dictation has helped alot.
What do you mean exactly by narrowing down to the essentials?
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BrendaPeter
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Just FYI -
I haven't ordered this yet, but I might try Better Spelling in 5 Minutes a Day. There is also an adult version entitled Better Spelling in 30 Minutes a Day.
Has anyone used either of these?
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Brenda (mom to 6)
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Tina P.
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Tina P. wrote:
| Right now we use McGraw Hill Spectrum spelling, which I like because it incorporates a little creative writing and a little grammar into the program. And when I think about it, I think possibly we might be doing too much because I have separate grammar, which also incorporates a little writing. Then vocabulary is separate, reading is separate... |
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I guess what I was trying to say is that I have a lot of subject incorporated into spelling and then I also treat the subjects separately. However, they are so lightly touched on in spelling that it really doesn't make that much of a difference.
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fsuadamson
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Another resource I have used over the years is "The Natural Speller" by Kathryn Stout. Again this is just used as a guideline.
We take all our spelling and grammar errors from the children's dictations and copywork and make lessons. When I see repeat errors we do more focus work like sentences, rhyming or family words, using clay or cursive writing to spell out. Kimberly Hahn in her Homeschooling book has suggested a wonderful system for taking spelling errors from children's writing assignments, and using those to improve spelling, that is worth looking into.
For grammar which we don't even touch until the children are writing fluently about 5th grade we have reviewed "Simply Grammar" by Karen Andreola and right now we are using the Bravewriter program which has been wonderful.
HTH,
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Donna
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Brenda,
I was wondering if you ever ordered this yet....if so, do you like it? I've never actually looked through it, only on the Amazon site...so it's hard to judge.
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lapazfarm
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I'm with Alice and Erin. We don't do vocabulary at all because ds learns so many new words from reading and from the different studies we do. We incorporate them into our writing (Bravewriter) and daily conversations about our topic, so they do become part of his "working vocabulary."
That incorporation never happened when we did a seperate spelling program (CHC).
I think it helps if the words are related to the topic at hand, rather than just a seperate list of words to learn all on their own.
We now do our spelling through our writing as well, working on correcting commonly missed words, and discussing why a new word is spelled the way it is.
It works well for us. Also cuts down on all the seperate "subjects" in a day.
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4Real Forums : Language Arts Come Alive
Topic: Vocabulary and Spelling
