| Author | |
folklaur
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: N/A
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2816
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 2:52pm | IP Logged
|
 |
|
Philothea wrote:
| Can I piggyback here? I would be interested to hear the folks from higher cost-of-living areas weigh in on this. |
|
|
We don't live in an extremely bad cost of living area (not like san diego, for instance) but the Phx metro area is a big city, and I would say it is average.
I just used a cost-of-living calculator and it said that making our average $38K for this area would be like making about $54K in the NoVa area.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Rachel May
Forum All-Star
Joined: June 24 2005
Location: Kansas
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2057
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 3:51pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
We live in NoVA, but we have military benefits to help. Commissary shopping etc, mostly free healthcare, cheap dental, housing allowance, gym membership. I know the value of those things is available online, but I don't know the numbers myself.
__________________
Rachel
Thomas and Anthony (10), Maria (8), Charles (6), Cecilia (5), James (3), and Joseph (1)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
LisaR
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 07 2005
Location: N/A
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2226
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 6:15pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
so, to expand further on this thread- is anyone bothered by the gas prices? I thought last summer was awful when in our area they almost reached 3.00 gal. Now, with it around 3.29 no one seems to be batting an eye. We have really noticed dairy going up as well as most all food. We are fortunate to live 5 miles from dh's job, and a mile from shopping. Still, I have found myself having to really consolidate/limit trips around town and still our gas budget is blown! I joined the library bookmobile for example for the summer reading program for the kids instead of visiting our regular library about 5 miles away. Every bit helps, right??
__________________
Lisa
dh Tim '92
Joseph 17
Paul 14
Thomas 11
Dominic 8
Maria Gianna 5
Isaac Vincent 9/21/10! and...
many little saints in heaven!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
time4tea
Forum All-Star
Joined: June 02 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 511
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 8:47pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I am very frustrated by gas prices and I also cannot understand why many people don't seem to be bothered by them. I feel as if I begin to hyperventilate every time I see them beginning to climb, because I budget only so much per week for gas for the car. I would think more people would be bothered by this, but apparently they aren't. I keep hearing on the radio how so many people are driving to different vacation destinations, etc., despite the prices.....
__________________
Blessings to you!
~Tea
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Leocea
Forum Pro
Joined: July 14 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 146
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 9:28pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I want to thank all of you so much for taking the time to respond to this!
I wanted to address a few things. First, yes, we have decided not to use NFP right now to avoid pregnancy. This is after many many prayers, most of mine starting with, Lord if this is wrong, let me husband just say no. Well, my "two is enough, we'll never have another" husband first said out of the blue in 2001 "Maybe we should have another baby." Then, in 2005, out of the blue, after telling many people (:-() that he was definitely DONE, he said "I think we should have more children." I have said we can use NFP, and I chart, but he is not wanting to do that, and I feel very strongly that God has sent me these answers!
If you had met my dh years ago, you wouldn't believe the differences now. I finally had to have him tell our families that this was not something I was bullying him into, lol. The change has been that dramatic. (How can anyone doubt the rosary works?!)
NFP is always there, of course, and our thoughts may change. Only God really knows. We just both feel really strongly that we are being called to have a large family that includes several more children.
I agree that financial status could be one of the grave reasons for choosing NFP. We don't feel that it is a valid reason for us at this time, though.
I should say that my husband DOES have time to be there for his children and me. In fact, although he works a lot of hours, almost all of his off-work hours are spent with his family. He spends more time with them now than he ever has! With this job, we are able to eat together as a family every night, which hasn't happened since our 14-year-old was a baby. We have time for a garden again, and to play games outside before it is dark. I wanted to clarify that. He could have another job like he used to, working 14-18 hours, but he would make similar money, and the little extra wouldn't be worth the time away from us.
I guess as long as our choices are led by God, after lots of prayer, we should just not worry so much. For instance, I recently had sinus surgery, and since he was off for the Fourth of July without pay, I told him not to take off for my surgery. God was guiding me then, because in years past, I would have been very resentful that this was necessary. He then worked the next day, too, from 4 am till 9 pm, for side work. He was off on Sunday, worked Monday, then was out of town for work overnight. This was hard, but God again was blessing us! Good friends took some of my children to play, and I had meals for almost a week! My recovery has been good, at almost two weeks out now.
All of your offers for prayer are so appreciated!
I was touched by so many of the replies, I can't respond personally to each one, but thank you from the bottom of my heart.
In Christ,
Leocea
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
chicken lady
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 27 2005
Location: N/A
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2315
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 9:29pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Well this is a great thread. I don't have any great advice, but I do want you to know you are not alone. After our son died the 4th largest bank in the US, fired my dh for takin gto much family leave! Yes, they really gave that as the reason......so we went for 14 mos with ZERO income! We literally lived 24 hrs at a time. He has now started a home based business that is slowly taking off. We don't have debt excepr for our mortgage, gratefully we both never believed in credit. We have always lived on the cash only basis, I have always bought second hand, and I have learned how to live literally on no income. It was OK, we live in an amzing area, people knew what was going on, and they always offered assistance. The hardest part for me personally was accepting the help. I fall hard  Today I am so grateful for the poverty, sounds crazy I know, but Christ choose poverty, he could have chosen wealth and modern convience, why then poverty? I think I know now, only because I have been forced into the world of the poor. I was not raised there, I had never thought I would be there, it happens on dime, it can happen to anyone very quickly. The best piece of advice I heard I will now share with you. The only family to compare your financial picture with is the Holy Family. I have found this comparision very comforting.
PAx
Molly
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Leocea
Forum Pro
Joined: July 14 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 146
|
| Posted: July 17 2007 at 9:54pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Unless I'm mistaken, the OP isn't asking for validation to use NFP or anyone's thoughts on whether they should or shouldn't use it.
It sounds to me, like they have made their decision to trust God in this matter, but have some natural trepidation about it. All those fears we all get when we feel we're not completely in control of the wheel, so to speak.  I could be wrong about the OP. Wouldn't be the first time.
Assuming I'm right...
<<I think you are RIGHT ON! This decision, after deciding to be Christians and then to convert to being Catholic, is the biggest one we have ever made. It is scary, too!>>
The important thing to remember is your dh is stressed and fearful too. He has the full weight of supporting the family on his shoulders! And however willing his back may be to bear that burden, having a wife to uplift and encourage (as in to give courage!) really does make it a lighter weight. My dh really needs to know his efforts aren't in vain and that I trust him.
anyhow, don't know that this made any sense, but it's my experience and .02 [/QUOTE]
<<This touched me more than anything else that was written. It helped me take the focus off of my own fears and acknowledge the fears my dh must have. In fact, he mentioned worrying about money today, and it's unusual for him to do that. I thought of your words, and just reassured him. Thank you.>>
In Christ,
Leocea
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Dawnie
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 30 2005
Location: Kansas
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 841
|
| Posted: July 19 2007 at 4:26pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Lisa,
Yes, the gas prices bother me! But, since the grocery store and the library are close by, I can limit my driving around town.
Unfortunately, it means that I have to limit those one-on-one visits with other mothers that lift me up so much. Pretty much all my friends live on the opposite side of town or OUT of town in the country. But, I absolutely refuse to raise the amount I have set aside for gas in our budget!! I'll stay home all week and only drive to church on Sunday if I have to...
The gas prices may also make out-of-state travel to visit my aging grandparents cost-prohibitive as well.
Dawn
__________________
Mom to Mary Beth (99), Anna (02), Lucia (04), Clara (06), and Adelaide Victoria (2/28/09)
Visit my blog!Water Into Wine:Vino Per Tutto!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Dawnie
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 30 2005
Location: Kansas
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 841
|
| Posted: July 19 2007 at 4:45pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
And now to your original question...
We have 4 children, and during each pregnancy, things were very tight financially...so much so, that at times I questioned whether or not we had made the "right" decision in actively seeking pregnancy. But although things were tight, we have ALWAYS had what we NEEDED. We have always had PLENTY to eat, a roof over our heads, money to pay for gas, electric, phone, internet, water, and trash service, at least one working car (usually two!), clothes on our backs, the school supplies and books we needed for the children, money to give to the Church and other charities, some money in savings, and usually a little left over to do with as we pleased. Wow, that sounds pretty good when I list it out like that!
On Monday, I went to a presentation by missionaries who worked in an African village for 18 months. It was VERY HUMBLING to see how those people live. All of us live like kings compared to them. They usually eat only ONE meal a day, and then it's some kind of corn-based, very starchy dish, they have no running water, no electricity or gas, and they live in huts with grass roofs. They sleep on the ground and they cook outside. Most of them had only one change of clothes. They live on less than $1 a day, along with about 75% of the people in this world. Watching the presentation, I was ashamed to think of all the times I have complained about "not having enough money." I have not had enough money to buy make-up, get my hair cut at a salon, buy new clothes and furniture, re-model my house, and go out to eat. I need to pray more for a spirit of poverty...
Dawn
__________________
Mom to Mary Beth (99), Anna (02), Lucia (04), Clara (06), and Adelaide Victoria (2/28/09)
Visit my blog!Water Into Wine:Vino Per Tutto!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
chicken lady
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 27 2005
Location: N/A
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2315
|
| Posted: July 19 2007 at 4:52pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Dawnie wrote:
I need to pray more for a spirit of poverty...
Dawn |
|
|
We all do, thanks for the reminder!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
KristinaP
Forum Pro
Joined: March 25 2005
Location: Virginia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 146
|
| Posted: July 19 2007 at 9:08pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Philothea wrote:
Can I piggyback here? I would be interested to hear the folks from higher cost-of-living areas weigh in on this. I'm pretty sure not many people in NoVA are raising six or seven kids on $35-40K. But can it be done comfortably in an area like this on under $100K? Assuming you own/rent the average $500-600K house, plus commuting costs, taxes, etc. I'm not talking about living lavishly -- I'm talking about making enough to feed, clothe and house that many kids and still pay the electric bill and buy gas every month.
What is the minimum salary you would think necessary to pull that off around here (without causing your DH to tear his hair out from the financial stress every month)?
Sorry if this is a hijack, it's just something DH and I have wondered about often as we discern God's will for our family. |
|
|
I know exactly where you're coming from. If this point gets taken up on another thread, I'll chime in but I just wanted to let you know that I'm on the exact same page as you.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
kris
Forum Newbie
Joined: March 31 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 36
|
| Posted: July 30 2007 at 4:36pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Good post, Dawn!
I just read this the other day.......
"People who love each other fully and truly-they are the happiest people in the world, and we see that with our very poor people. They love their children, and they love their home. They may have very little, they may have nothing, but they are happy people....."
Mother Teresa
I often wonder if it is a matter of *attitude*....do we bring children into the world (perhaps many) and if there is a financial struggle, worry and stew and walk about as if there is a huge burden ( which is really easy to do...don't get me wrong! ) or do we show our children that we embrace an impoverished (financially) life ( if you can call it that here in the US :) with joy?
__________________
Kris
married to Tim 6-83
mom to Al (87) Zak (89) Dylan (91) Noah (92) Naomi (94) Jackson (96) George ( 98) Samuel ^i^ 2000, Jed (03) Manny (05) and Gabriella (06)
http://myspiritrejoices.blogspot.c
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Karen T
Forum All-Star
Joined: Feb 16 2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 927
|
| Posted: Aug 05 2007 at 9:26am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Martha wrote:
If he wants to get a degree, it's not too late. He won't be the only middle aged man there I assure you.
|
|
|
I know I'm replying very late in this, but this caught my eye. When i married dh he was in the navy (enlisted, on submarines). We did the navy thing for a few more years, then he got out, with no retirement. He was about 34 then, and since then he's worked in retail (computers mostly), done navy reserves and gone to school part-time. it took him almost 10 yrs to finish his degree, b/c he had to take off a semester every year to do his 2 weeks active duty, he also took off several times when we had another child, and then he lost his job to downsizing (Gateway). Fortunately through this, I was able to work part-time and we staggered our hours so that one of us was always home with the kids. He finally got his business degree last Dec and has a job with the govt now. He's 44 and in a starting position there but I'm very proud of him. He also retired from reserves this spring. However, his new salary is barely what the two of us were making before, and now that he's full-time I won't be working, and we're moving somewhere where the housing is almost double what we pay here.
I just wanted to say it's definitely never too late to go to college, if that's what someone wants to do. and also sympathize with having to squeeze to make ends meet!
Karen T
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
CAgirl4God
Forum Pro
Joined: May 04 2007
Location: Puerto Rico
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 419
|
| Posted: Aug 07 2007 at 9:11am | IP Logged
|
|
|
kris wrote:
Good post, Dawn!
I just read this the other day.......
"People who love each other fully and truly-they are the happiest people in the world, and we see that with our very poor people. They love their children, and they love their home. They may have very little, they may have nothing, but they are happy people....."
Mother Teresa
I often wonder if it is a matter of *attitude*....do we bring children into the world (perhaps many) and if there is a financial struggle, worry and stew and walk about as if there is a huge burden ( which is really easy to do...don't get me wrong! ) or do we show our children that we embrace an impoverished (financially) life ( if you can call it that here in the US :) with joy?
|
|
|
when I started to let go of all my materialism, I found that I was alot happier, and not as stressed about 'life' in general.
I let my dh worry about the bills, I was just prudent with our $$. I only buy what we need (for the most part, but esp when things were very tight). things now are better, but I still only buy what we need when we need it.
like clothes food, etc...
we are a happy family. we have tons of fun. and my dh is a chief in the military... not a huge salary. but we have med insurance, and usually housing, and we get by in VERY high cost of living places (Marin county CA, Santa Barbara county CA, CT and now Puerto Rico. none of these places have been inexpensive to live in).
***so, to expand further on this thread- is anyone bothered by the gas prices? I thought last summer was awful when in our area they almost reached 3.00 gal. Now, with it around 3.29 no one seems to be batting an eye. ***
gas prices in Santa Barbara were outrageous! lol $3.50 or more per gallon. here in PR we are seeing it around $2.50 a gallon. that is a nice break. they sell it by hte liter here, so when I saw it for hte first time the sign said "$.68" I about drove off the road LOL.
__________________
Home is where the Coast Guard sends us
Jamie, married to John
JC, Nugget, Christina & Judy
Chowder
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
SallyT
Forum All-Star
Joined: Aug 08 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2489
|
| Posted: Aug 21 2007 at 3:51pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
This is a great thread, I agree!
We, too, are converts and have 4 children, the first three spaced fairly far apart (4 years between the first two, almost 5 years between #s 2 and 3), with number four an exciting 16 months younger than her immediately-older brother. Our first two kids we had as reasonably middle-class income-and-a-half people -- my husband was an Episcopal priest, albeit the lowest-paid in our diocese, but still decently paid, I think in retrospect. I was teaching part-time as a university writing instructor.
In 1999, when our older kids were 5.5 and 20 months, we moved to England where we spent the next 4 years while my husband did a Ph.d. We had known that we wanted more than two children, and after much dithering had #3 in England, while we were a student family. At that point we were living on the last of our grant money and about to run through our savings and into student loans so my husband could stay an extra year to finish his thesis.
I got pregnant with #4 when #3 was 7 months old, in the middle of a long-running argument with my husband over the use of contraception. We weren't Catholic at the time (which was my argument, as I blush to think now -- "Why do we care about the Magisterium?? We AREN'T CATHOLIC."). He was finishing his thesis, our visas were running out, there was no job in sight for him, and we had run out of money. From a "worldly" perspective, not a great time to be having a baby. Oh, and we'd been on the NHS in England all that time, so we had no medical insurance, either.
I won't bore you with any more details except to say that this was the experience which God used to teach me to be open to life, and to trust. Not to be un-prudential, necessarily, but to trust. In our life since that time -- baby #4, who's now 3.5, was born in December of 2003 here in the US -- we have known a lot of financial stress. My husband has a Ph.d in theology, but for the past four years has not been able to find full-time academic work with benefits. So he has pieced things together -- lots and lots of adjunct jobs, plus at one point he did a stint as a security guard to make ends meet. He currently does not have benefits; I have one of those high-deductible cheap-premiums policies (so you pay for insurance you can't really afford to use, but at least if you HAVE to go to the doctor, they will talk to you), and the kids are on a state Medicaid plan. We have in the past qualified for and used food stamps. Going to the DHS, when I was pregnant and we had these other kids and no job and on and on, was one of the hardest, and also the most humbling experiences of my life. Sitting in the waiting room with all these much more obviously down-and-out people, I remember thinking, "But we're not like these people." God's answer: you're human, aren't you? I made you. Well, I made them, too.
Depending on aid, and also accepting aid from our family, has been a source of mortification for our pride -- and this is a good thing. God has never let us go hungry or be homeless, and we have had to understand that everything comes from Him. And our life has been full of good things: our children, our homeschooling, the creative ways we've had to make ends meet. I think we are a far closer family for having had to work together to make ends meet. Our old vans, one of which was given to us by a friend, have been kind of a family joke; we've been pretty creative in cooking with things like dried beans and flour and home-grown tomatoes and squash; my oldest daughter learned to sew so that she could make her own clothes, etc. I contribute what I can financially by writing, doing advertising on my blog, reselling books, selling Usborne Books, and mostly by trying to save money however I can. I've gotten pretty good at home haircuts!
Honestly, I would love a break from worry, too. On the other hand, I'm really grateful for what we have. My mother helped us to buy our first house ever last year, so when I'm tempted to be frustrated because I don't have the money to paint the living room, I have to remember to be grateful that I have the house. Things are looking up all the time. And we just have to trust.
All that to echo the same theme: God provides. And He teaches and leads and does His best to make us holy in spite of ourselves. And in our case, it was a little unexpected child who really taught us all this. She may well be our last -- because of age and waning fertility -- but she came with enough grace to last us a lifetime.
Gosh, I do go on. But I've really been glad to read everyone else's stories. I always find ideas and inspiration in how other families, often with more kids and stresses than we have, not only get by but flourish on little.
Love and prayers to you all,
Sally
__________________
Castle in the Sea
Abandon Hopefully
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
|
|
4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: Average family income- dh jobs??
