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countrymom
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| Posted: July 01 2015 at 10:42am | IP Logged
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How do you experienced moms deal with the guilt? In my case, we have home educated since birth. So there is not the ability to be tempted to say "It was bad influence at school" We have always sought quality over quantity with friends and playmates. I have basically given my life to homeschooling. I get very discouraged (yes, I know discouragement is from the devil) when my child falls into sin again.
When I was a young mom, and chatting with other hs'ing moms, I was on such a high horse regarding my children. I would NEVER raise a child "like that" were my thoughts. I would never have "that" happen in my house. Those moms must not be doing enough, or too worldly or whatever my young naive mind and pride thought.
My priest is very direct. He says you taught the child properly, they know the truth. They make their choices, they have free will. But I still can't help feeling like I did not do enough to instill true piety and virtue in my child. I know I didn't, because I am a selfish sinner myself....
So again, perspective please from experienced moms of older children.
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JodieLyn
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| Posted: July 01 2015 at 12:03pm | IP Logged
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Sometimes the best thing we can do is to do less. When I let my young child experience touching something that's hot enough to hurt (but not burn) they learn better than if I jumped in and did more to protect them.
You have taught them. Your priest is right that they make their own choices and have their own free will. As adults (I'd even say older teens), they have the tools to alleviate ignorance, so it's not a lack of teaching on anyone's part that can be blamed. Flip it around. You're feeling guilty for not doing enough. What would you say to your child if they blamed you for not doing enough? Would you let them have that crutch? help them keep from owing their own decisions? Don't give yourself the guilt and handicap that you wouldn't let your child use.
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jawgee
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| Posted: July 01 2015 at 12:09pm | IP Logged
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Prayers. 
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Martha
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 8:32am | IP Logged
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I've been cursing free will for over a decade now.
It's not much comfort, but your priest is right.
By light of day, I love hem and encourage them down the right paths as best I can.
By dark of night, I intermix crying and praying they take it.
Same as I suspect every mother has, even the mothers of saints.
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Becky Parker
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 9:12am | IP Logged
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Martha wrote:
Same as I suspect every mother has, even the mothers of saints.
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Yes! St. Monica comes to mind. (Mother of St. Augustine)
I heard a priest who told a group of mothers that sometimes, our children need to walk away from the Lord in order to know they can (testing out that free will thing!). Then we pray that they come back, and usually, they eventually do. The teen years are hard. I thought we had made it through without any issues. Then came college, a good college mind you, and now I have a son who I'm on my knees for regularly. I just keep praying and trusting that he is going to come back.
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Pilgrim
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 9:58am | IP Logged
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I/we totally hear you! Our foray into the teen years has been a bit hard for me to swallow, but prayer will surely carry us through! It's hard to see our teens, who used to like and follow our family ways more, grow up and start to have their own likes, opinions, etc.
I think, too, when we are young parents, *we* have come along, and left behind many of our own teenage idiocies, and are strong and firm in our Faith, so we have this naive confidence that where we have come to will be where our children will want to be when they get older. That, naturally what we have taught them will be easy for them to see and they will want to live it too, "of course!" Then they grow into their own person, and they can shock us with their own person they are becoming.
Thankfully the media our oldest likes is pretty well in line with our own choices, she likes classical singing, etc, so that is a blessing. Buuuuuttt, if she had her choice in clothes, beyond the concessions to the *slightly* more flashy designs that we allow, I think she would have troubles. She also has a huge desire to be a big singing star or a movie actress( conservative music/movies, but still).  I guess my point is that our kids choices and likes, etc. will be different than ours, and truly the best we can do is patiently and gently guide them, and then let them have free will.
The world we live in is not one of holiness, the traps for our young people are beyond numerous, and everywhere they turn. It is so very hard to live in our culture and stay holy, good, and pure, but God's Mercy will reign in the end. The best we can do is teach and guide when they are young, give advice as they grow, then PRAY, PRAY, PRAY.
I know so very well the feelings you are having. Our daughter has changed some in her dress(more just kinda strange, not allowed immodesty) and wanted to dye her hair a normal color(red from strawberry blond) and we let her. At church I sometimes feel like I wonder if the conservative families we would really like to be friends with, to help keep her grounded and see the good in being conservative, as we are, may be kinda turned off and think badly of us. But, in the end, my love for her as our precious daughter overrules any feelings that are there of worrying what others think.
Like you, we have always been very careful, choosing quality over quantity with friends, homeschooled, been very careful of the media we allow in the house. But, in the end our kids do head out into the world. As they become older, they become much more aware of this big world out there, and some things draw them and they struggle. Keep praying, stay close to God, lean on Him and Our Lady through these difficult times, you will make it through!!!!!
Oh, and Our Lady of the Miraculous Medal has been a Huge, huge help in our household. At times when I feel like things are just going so wrong, and the conversations with dd are the hardest, or I feel worried over her, or other dc, or have an argument with dh, etc, etc, I kiss the Miraculous Medal, pray the prayer on it, and ask Our Lady to intercede for the particular problem, and I cannot remember a time where things have not gotten better, truly. I wear a lightweight Mir. Medal on my scapular, so it's easily accessible for such moments. 
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Erica Sanchez
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 10:41am | IP Logged
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After a year or so of struggling with or butting heads with our teen son, it hit me that the character flaws I perceived in him were the same flaws I saw in myself! I had modeled these for him all these year! :(
No excuses for either of us, but it helped me not be so upset or so hard on him.
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countrymom
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 1:35pm | IP Logged
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Thank you so much for your kind conversation ladies. I will read this again and again for that much needed friendly council when I feel like a terrible mom.
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countrymom
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| Posted: July 02 2015 at 1:38pm | IP Logged
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Pilgrim wrote:
At church I sometimes feel like I wonder if the conservative families we would really like to be friends with, to help keep her grounded and see the good in being conservative, as we are, may be kinda turned off and think badly of us. But, in the end, my love for her as our precious daughter overrules any feelings that are there of worrying what others think.
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I think this is the reason why Our Lord has let things like this happen in our family. I probably would have been one of those conservative moms who would have judged you in the past and not really gotten to know you. Now that Our Lord has thrown me off my high horse, I see things differently.
How hard it is when everything looks good on the outside, but things that can't be seen are difficult. And we DO love our children so much and are doing are best with the graces God has given us to do our duty in our state of life. No matter what sins our children commit, or what color they dye their hair. 
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countrymom
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Erica Sanchez wrote:
After a year or so of struggling with or butting heads with our teen son, it hit me that the character flaws I perceived in him were the same flaws I saw in myself! I had modeled these for him all these year! :(
No excuses for either of us, but it helped me not be so upset or so hard on him. |
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A good friend of mine with 3 adult children said this exact same thing. I was a naughty and worldly teenager in the late 90's. If I look back on the sins I committed (but I did not believe in sin then...I was a naturalistic liberal pagan, I did not even know the meaning of the word virtue!) I see pretty much the same spirit of things my child is doing. I guess I just feel so terrible because I did my best to teach my child a different way than I was taught.
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JodieLyn
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Don't forget there's also two things going on here.
1) you don't need to feel guilty for their free will choice
2) you're going to grieve their poor choices anyway.. but grief is not guilt
And for full disclosure.. I have a daughter who had her hair colored bright red and purple.. as a birthday gift from us. She'd been wanting to do it for some time and had really thought through the consequences of having the bright colors in her hair and had decided that the best choice was the 4-6inches of the ends of her hair. So yeah, for her 15th birthday we gave her the gift of getting her hair colored. It was actually cute. It lasted about 3 months fairly bright and has since faded away to almost nothing. She may get it colored again after swim season.. but it'll have to be gone before she can be on the cheerleading squad at the high school in November. Pretty self limiting, she had fun, and it didn't hurt anyone. 
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Jodie, wife to Dave
G-18, B-17, G-15, G-14, B-13, B-11, G-9, B-7, B-5, B-4
All men who have turned out worth anything have had the chief hand in their own education.
-Sir Walter Scott
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Pilgrim
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| Posted: July 04 2015 at 6:14am | IP Logged
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countrymom wrote:
Pilgrim wrote:
At church I sometimes feel like I wonder if the conservative families we would really like to be friends with, to help keep her grounded and see the good in being conservative, as we are, may be kinda turned off and think badly of us. But, in the end, my love for her as our precious daughter overrules any feelings that are there of worrying what others think.
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I think this is the reason why Our Lord has let things like this happen in our family. I probably would have been one of those conservative moms who would have judged you in the past and not really gotten to know you. Now that Our Lord has thrown me off my high horse, I see things differently.
How hard it is when everything looks good on the outside, but things that can't be seen are difficult. And we DO love our children so much and are doing are best with the graces God has given us to do our duty in our state of life. No matter what sins our children commit, or what color they dye their hair. |
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Yes, I think that is a bit of what has happened for me/us. We have learned not to judge so much with others. Yes, one has to discern; there are some families where their dress, behaviors, etc. are definitely people we want to avoid for the influence factor as one can tell they are not on the same page at all. But, we have learned not all is necessarily as it seems from the outside. We do not know the struggles others are going through. A good lesson to learn about charity! 
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Pilgrim
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| Posted: July 04 2015 at 6:20am | IP Logged
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JodieLyn wrote:
Don't forget there's also two things going on here.
1) you don't need to feel guilty for their free will choice
2) you're going to grieve their poor choices anyway.. but grief is not guilt
And for full disclosure.. I have a daughter who had her hair colored bright red and purple.. as a birthday gift from us. She'd been wanting to do it for some time and had really thought through the consequences of having the bright colors in her hair and had decided that the best choice was the 4-6inches of the ends of her hair. So yeah, for her 15th birthday we gave her the gift of getting her hair colored. It was actually cute. It lasted about 3 months fairly bright and has since faded away to almost nothing. She may get it colored again after swim season.. but it'll have to be gone before she can be on the cheerleading squad at the high school in November. Pretty self limiting, she had fun, and it didn't hurt anyone. |
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1) and 2) are such good advice.
Yes, we let her dye her hair kind of as a birthday/ Christmas thing. She wanted to dye her hair red for Christmas, her favorite holiday. Like you said, we decided it was fairly harmless compared to so many things a kid could want to do, and one needs to be able to say "Yes" to some things. It was a lesson for her in how some decisions can be more permanent than others, and have consequences you may not expect. We had talked a bit about how the hair would look when only half dyed after a while, how it would take quite a while to get back to her regular color and it hadn't really sunk in. Now it has! S
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4Real Forums : Mothering and Family Life
Topic: when your teen child makes bad choices
